Topic: Working for a property w/horrible ratings and high turnover w/mgt companys

I am currently managing a 509 bed residence hall on a Universtity (privately owned) but want to go back into property management. I was interveiwed by a property and offered the AM position with advancement opportunities around 90 days. I knew driving up it wasnt the Taj Mahal as the curb appeal was none existenet and the parking lot was littered with trash, to include the walkway to the office. Before the interview I researched the property and came acrsoss reviews like, "Beware" "I'll pay you not to live here!" "Cant wait until my lease it up" "Trailer park w/out the trailers" and etc.

I know there are people that can never be satisfied, but there were no less than a dozen reviews on each site. Also, the management company has changed 4 times in 6 years. :ohmy:

My question is should I stay away from properties like this? Is it likely I will need to look for another job in a year or so? I am just so unsure what to do! The pay does not motivate me, because I make pretty good money where I am, but I really want to get back on the multifamily side.

Thanks.

I wholeheartedly say yes go for it. I understand the trepidation about signing on with a troubled property but think about the sense of accomplishment you will feel when you successfully turned it around. Challenging properties help managers keep their motivation. The more challenging or exciting you find a property the more likely you are to stay motivated.

In addition, a challenging property will push you to be a better manager. The harder your job is and more requires of you, the more likely it is you'll work towards learning new skills or improving on the ones you already have.

Best of luck to you!

Renae, I would like to build on what Emily was saying, that I think it a good idea to take over a troubled place and make a difference. But lets take a pause and look within yourself and ask yourself if you are willing to go for it!

Sounds like there are some challanges for you and for me that is exciting, but then you know you and what you want. I do think you should ask some questions as to why there were so many changes in management companies and if there is a change again, what your future would be like as well.

So, even though we all say go for it, it comes down to; are you scared of the fight and do you know yourself. What part of the multifamily industry did you miss? What is it about where you are at now that you do not like? Make a list for yourself Pro's and Con's and after which list is bigger. That maybe a start as to if you are up to the new position.

For sure seeing what the people are complaining about and then lets assume they are all true, do you have what it takes to overcome those faults and let them know there is a new sheriff in town?

Then the last thing is there is a positive as there is nowhere to go but UP!

My advice is to be very careful before considering a property like the one you described. When making a change it's better to be going toward something you want. Changing for the sake of change can easily bring you to a worse situation than the one you are leaving. Do you really want to make a change to a property owned by someone who either consistently hires bad management companies for you to work for, or who is such a bad owner that good management companies quit? One of those two scenarios is likely in play. Why would you put yourself in either situation? I wouldn't do it.

Hi Emily thanks for answering. I love a challenge and the feeling of accomplishment. I'm mostly afraid that me coming in making changes will upset the new staff as they are set in their lazy ways. The whole time I was in the interview and taking a property tour the LAs and maintenance men were chatting it up when I saw plenty on their tour path that could be adressed. I feel sorry for the residents...it's that bad. I just don't want to face so much opposition as I did with my current position. I also don't want to kill myself trying to turn this property around, but I'm so ready to get away from these college kids and coddling parents!!!!

Hi Nate you sure are a presence around here!!

I love the challenge as I was able to turn my current property into something to be reckoned with, so the challenge I have no problem staring down. My fear is the change in mgt companies..apparently the occupancy tends to run very low and tenure is obsolete. I just dont want to end up looking again in another year or so. Also, the staff is horrible. I don't mind being cruella but it's so much easier and enjoyable to work as a team. The PM is in a position where she can't fire the current staff as the PM & AM positions are open...the poor thing works in the corp office and they have been having a doozy trying to fill the positions.

The thing I miss most about multifamily is working with adults and not having the need to do a lease up every school year. You ever moved 500 people in on the same day while catering to all 500 families as well??? It keeps me on my toes and gives me so much insight I didn't have in multifamily, but I miss those moments of tranquility :lol: Also, I get no help from the staff and I have no power to term! I have a Finance Manager and Marketing Coordinator that I can recommend to be termed but it comes down to my GM...one is family and the other a friend of the family. As you can guess they have it made and I leave drained everyday! :S

But I know if I can manage a dorm of Freshman I can doit all. The community events I have to do are enough to make me a Nobel prize recipient. I just always worry...

Hi Steve! I definitely can understand what you're saying as those are my reservations. I forgot to mention my dorm won't be around long. We were the 1st and only traditional residence hall on campus in 86' and although my company won't say it's over when the contract ends in less than two years the writing is on the wall. UTSA is building a traditional residence hall set to open when our contract ends. Now they will have 2 apartment style properties and a dorm on campus. What does that tell you?? I just to make moves before it gets bad, but at least I have time to pick. Thing is not too many employers are calling me back, so I'm also worried about that as well.

Hello Renea,

For sure when a manager comes in and sees the changes that need to happen, in order to make change you have to step on toes sometimes. It is the nature of some to be resistant to change. I am keying in on the words lazy ways, so someone has to be the bad guy and maybe those before you did not want to rock the boat or started to and their bluff was called and they backed down for whatever reason.

So, I would let the management know you need so many days to observe and then you will come to them with a plan of action. Once you have observed developed your plan, then go to the management with the plan and get buy in before you go out an execute. Then you know with certainty you plan has backing. You will need support first and for most in order to make a change and be affective doing so.

Then I would get my residents and introduce yourself and let them know you are and new person and you have see there is work to be done. Get their feedback and do the easy tasks first, so they can start seeing some immediate changes.

You also want to consider what Steve wrote as well because he has a point as well. My advice is if you do decide to get in there, then observe, formulate a plan, get buy in, and then execute the agreed upon plan.

The other two things I read are you do not want to kill yourself trying to turn the property around and I can tell you with properties that have been neglected and there are issues on many levels will call for and investment on yourside which will cause for making some very hard calls I am sure. The other thing is coddling parents vs. tenants that are all about where they are living and there will be some that will get in your face. Make that list Pros and Cons.

We all will tell you from our perspective and give you maybe some fresh ideas, but the ultimate call is yours to make. Once you jump in you have to be committed, if you are not and there is doubt, then I can see you looking for another position in 90 days. But somewhere in there as an Asset Manager I am sure there is junk yard dog that will not back down when the going gets tough!

Hey Renae,

First, very exciting to see your interest in working in the industry! It's a great one as you likely are aware and while certain bad apples exist, they definitely don't make up the lot!

So what to do in your situation? A great opportunity exist, especially given it appears that this community has hit rock bottom. What I would challenge you to do is to propose to the company a new customer service benchmark initiative that you will drive first at that community. These benchmarks will include

1. increasing resident satisfaction by seeing a reduction in complaints through these online channels
2. increasing resident satisfaction by seeing positive comments posted on these online channels
3. measuring speed for maintenance team to correct resident issues
4. measuring to see if a reduction in maintenance call-backs occurs
5. before and after photos of community curb appeal (reduction in trash for example)

Set up a goal to measure these (measure month over month) and report back. If this system works then train team to continue and reward them for helping to increase prospects via referrals, customer satisfaction and renewals, then request to set up an action committee (this could be you) to review other communities and implement the same system.

If you see positive change, set up a testimonial turnaround campaign that showcases this to residents (and their referrals, if you elect to build a referral program through this effort) as well as to prospects. I think prospects will appreciate your turnaround and the honesty of the effort and why you did it.

Good luck!

It is always better to have choices than to have none. You are in a position where you can take charge of your destination, albeit for the time being. Before I woudl agree to a management position, I would look at the property and pinpoint immediate areas in need of improvement. In this case, it would be staffing, curb appeal, any deferred maintenance, etc. THEN: ask yourself this: CAN I CHANGE THIS PROPERTY? DO I WANT THE CHALLENGE? WILL I DEVOTE THE TIME NECESSARY TO TURN IT AROUND? Be honest with yourself. I think once you answer these questions for yourself, then it becomes a matter of determining practical goals based on the property's current position financially (are they cash flowing, able to meet expenses), occupancy (obviously they need to get better, so is it cleanliness, deferred maintenance, leasing professionals?), setting marketing plans in place, and finally - will you have upper management support? Or, should that be #1???? Probably :)

It is hard to make the change and take the plunge. Tough properties can be turned around, but it usually takes a good full year to do it. Do you have contacts who are interested in moving with you? Having the best team in place is imperative, so sometimes you do need to get rid of the baggage.

Take a deep breath. It is always best to reflect on this for a while and don't be afraid to ask the person hiring what their goals are for the property. A good dialogue is important because you want to be, not only in the same book, but also on the same page.

Good Luck!

I did not read everyone's reply, so I apologize if I make similar observations. I think you need to determine what is best for you based on your ability to risk not having a job, as well as your ability to take on the challenge. The red flag for me was the change of management - 4 in 6 years. This to me says either the property has gone through receivership or other problematic situations that could in fact jeopardize all site employees' jobs. If a management company switch occurs on a property like this, most likely those coming in would tend to evaluate existing employees as perhaps part of the problem - even if they are not - and choose not to hire them on. I think a property with this much distress is also probably in dire need of an influx of cash and even Houdini would be challenged to turn around customer service when he doesn't have parts to make repairs or the money to pay the lawn vendor. Good luck with your decision.

So I decided not to take this position. Too many lies and dishonesty went on as I questioned the RPM. I wanted facts and for her to be honest with me about the property, but all I heard was how they close at zero by the 18th every month, one eviction in five years, collections are a breeze, etc. I didn't even want to go down that road! Good thing is I still have time to look and be choosy!! I just can't understand why they would try to cover up lies when they can be easily found out. Don't tell me you're at 98% when you're really at 88% not cool! If I can't trust them now how can I when I start working?? No thanks.

In finding a manager that will need to tame a beast, I look for someone that sees the potential-definitively- and is an absolute juggernaut in bringing their vision to fruition. If you were asked on day-1 to present a 30 day action plan for repositioning the property, what would your plan include? Are you positive the plan would be effective? Most importantly, would your enthusiasm be so contagious that you would draw despondent residents and under performers into your wave of change?
If you have any doubt that you're the perfect fix, I'd keep searching. We're fortunate in our business that there are many opportunities and a diverse talent pool to match. Best of luck!

In finding a manager that will need to tame a beast, I look for someone that sees the potential-definitively- and is an absolute juggernaut in bringing their vision to fruition. If you were asked on day-1 to present a 30 day action plan for repositioning the property, what would your plan include? Are you positive the plan would be effective? Most importantly, would your enthusiasm be so contagious that you would draw despondent residents and under performers into your wave of change?
If you have any doubt that you're the perfect fix, I'd keep searching. We're fortunate in our business that there are many opportunities and a diverse talent pool to match. Best of luck!

I believe I was the perfect match but one also needs support and the need to trust those around you. How can I work for anyone that is not honest about what is truly going on?? If you lie to me at the beginning there is no telling what they will lie about once I start. I cannot fathom why they wouldn't want to be honest. I'm telling the RPM " I've heard the exact opposite" or " your numbers dont say that." she continues to drive around the truth. No thanks. They missed out because i was truly ready to show them that property could be a gem!

Hello,
The rewards for turning a property around will include placing you in the unique position of being a "turnaround" specialist, and you will be in demand and will always have job security. Plus you will sharpen every management skill you have and create some skills you did not know you have!

But before taking the job look into several areas. And, think like an owner.

Ask to see the last 3 years (if available) financials and occupancy reports or summaries. What occupancy is required for break even? What is the cash flow and what are expenses? What funds are available to carry the property if it is losing money now? How bad are the skips, evictions, and bad debt? How much clean up of bad (non-paying) residents is required? Bad properties in bad neighborhoods are 100X more difficult that good properties in good neighborhoods.


1. Is the property in a bad neighborhood with high crime...you cannot fix this.
2. Is the owner or management company financially weak? If so, you will not have the funds for turns, repairs, security, "curb appeal", advertizing ect. If this is the case, the property will be in a downward spiral and will increasingly get worse.

Will the owner or Property Management Company agree to a 12-24 month turn around plan? If it is really "upside down" it will take this long to get the property really healthy. Can the owner last this long? How long can the owner last?

If the owner or property management company will not share this information...run, do not walk away from this property!

Good Luck

So the RPM just called me begging me in a way to reconsider. I have done that and I get warm all over thinking how great it would be to make a turn around, but how can't I tell her just be straight with me without being harsh or unprofessional?? I can't work for a company not knowing the full story.

HI Renae,

I love the idea of turning a property around. I recently took over a property that is 3 years old and changed hands 4 times, was in lease up and 63% occ for 2 years! But when I took over the mgmt company that hired me had an agressive plan to turn the property around. So first ask those questions is it the staff or the mgmt company. Who will be behind you. The staff is easy to change set expectations from the outset and lead by example. Meet with every team member and let them know what you expect in no uncertain terms. You can either help them up or get them out and the sooner you do either the easier your job will be. You also may find that they want to change and need the leadership necessary to do so. So after almost two years at this property we leased up in less than 6 months and won 5 awards with the local apartment association and our online reviews are changing for the better. And I get great letter from the residents about our staff on a regualr basis. Good luck it will take a lot of hard work and long hours but you can do it!

Tom (An owner) wrote:

Hello,
The rewards for turning a property around will include placing you in the unique position of being a "turnaround" specialist, and you will be in demand and will always have job security. Plus you will sharpen every management skill you have and create some skills you did not know you have!

But before taking the job look into several areas. And, think like an owner.

Ask to see the last 3 years (if available) financials and occupancy reports or summaries. What occupancy is required for break even? What is the cash flow and what are expenses? What funds are available to carry the property if it is losing money now? How bad are the skips, evictions, and bad debt? How much clean up of bad (non-paying) residents is required? Bad properties in bad neighborhoods are 100X more difficult that good properties in good neighborhoods.


1. Is the property in a bad neighborhood with high crime...you cannot fix this.
2. Is the owner or management company financially weak? If so, you will not have the funds for turns, repairs, security, "curb appeal", advertizing ect. If this is the case, the property will be in a downward spiral and will increasingly get worse.

Will the owner or Property Management Company agree to a 12-24 month turn around plan? If it is really "upside down" it will take this long to get the property really healthy. Can the owner last this long? How long can the owner last?

If the owner or property management company will not share this information...run, do not walk away from this property!

Good Luck

This is why I am so hesitant as they are not being truthful to me. I was able to see a little as they tested my knowledge of the software what I saw was not pretty! I'd feel better if they were honest with me.

Hi Renae -

There's so much great input from everyone and definitely a lot to consider, so the only other thoughts I would share are these:
- First, if you take on the property, what support will you have from the PM company? Will you be supported in decisions that you have to make for the improvement of the staff and community?
- Second, regarding the online comments. Online reputation is a direct result of onsite reputation. Until residents see that real change and real service is being implemented, you'll see more of the same online. That said, most people go to work wanting to do a good job. Often, what appears as lazy may be a result of micromanagement, lack of management, lack of support, or general absence of leadership. If they don't know what "good" looks like, it's difficult to achieve it. Your desire to make a positive difference and your willingness to demonstrate a new vision for the staff and residents may be the foundation the staff needs to start taking pride in their work and their community.

Best wishes to you during your decision-making!

The previous post has important ideas to consider. You want to see this property improve. This can be very rewarding, although time-consuming & stressful. The most important consideration before accepting this position to be sure the owner/ mgmt company has the same goals as you have.

Renae,

RUN the other way! I too love a challenge, and many times have been very successful; however that success only came with awesome support. If you don't have support you are only beating your head against the wall. You will only succeed in creating frustration and resentment for yourself. Follow you instincts. The fact that you posted here in the first place says you had serious questions about this community and instead of the RPM making you feel excited about the challenge, she made you feel distrustful. If that person misrepresented the situation to you before you are even hired, it's a good sign of what's to come.
I’ve been in the business for 14 years and like to say I’ve worked for the good, the bad, and the ugly. I’ve worked for private owners, a REIT and a management company. Every property I’ve ever had has been a problem child. The only communities I felt I’d made an impact on were those where I had outstanding support form the RPM and Corp. I once had a property that was on its way to a full turn around. The residents were satisfied, rent collections were on the upswing, but we weren’t leasing fast enough. Rather than discuss the situation with me the RPM decided I wasn’t getting the job done and transferred me to a smaller site. I later found out this was only done because one of her friends was about to lose her position so she moved her to my old site where I had done all the work and all she had to do was ride the wave. It worked out okay for me though as I just chilled at the smaller site, caught up on my reading, updated my resume and was hired at the company I’m with now.
If you question the integrity of a person or company from the beginning it’s a sure bet that it’s not going to get any better. There are many communities out there that need someone like you so don’t settle. GOOD LUCK!

Unfortunately I am just a leasing consultant but I am in the same situation. Before I was interviewed I had learned about the terrible ratings but I have a family and this place was closer to home and offered more vacation time. Now that I'm here the poor ratings were spot on! I don't want to just up an leave. I'm ready to get firmly planted with a company. But how do I make changes from the bottom???

The one thing you should think about, Mrs. Bethea, is learning to think like an owner and to quit thinking as though you are "just a leasing consultant." The next thing is to observe. Watch how the manager interacts with the team, residents, and RPM and other people at the corporate level. Then concentrate on being the best leasing professional your property has ever experienced. Be friendly to all with whom you have contact. Learn how to answer the phone and lease apartments. Learn to overcome leasing objections. Learn about the problems that have occurred on site - deferred maintenance? Untrustworthy management? Work orders not being completed in a timely fashion? Devise a way to answer and counter these negative impressions of your property. Your pleasant and positive attitude can go a long way in helping to turnaround perceptions. Most leasing professionals strive to become something else within a company. Take some classes. Get your NALP designation. Take some webinars on line. Follow your Manager's recommendations, too, for moving up with this company or when the time comes, a different one. But get rid of the "I'm just a ..." pity party. No one is her job. Once you start leasing apartments and meeting the goals you have set with your manager and company you will feel successful, confident and ready for new challenges.