Maybe It Should Really Be Called "Social NOTWorking"?

LT-
I had to think a while before going with my gut reaction of "Say WHAT?" I don't disagree with the points made in the presentation, not one bit, HOWEVER...

If you had told me in 1994 that in 5 years, I'd be paying out only 1/4 of what I am for print and moving all the rest of my stuff to "on line listings" I would have thought you were crazy. The world's communications are moving more and more rapidly, and I think that it's better to be moving with the train than standing in front of it. I think that being an early mover on platforms like twitter and facebook can be highly advantageous. As communication moves more to the keyboard and less to the phone, early adopters of SM are going to be better positioned to not only catch new residents but also retain them. I think that at the heart of it, Social NETWORKING is a much better tool for resident retention than for resident attraction.

(Also, aside from making an AMAZING network of industry friends and professionals, I've personally gained 3 new clients via Twitter in the last year. It's a low proportion to what I've gained via site visits, phone calls and e-newsletters, BUT I see it as one more avenue to reach my clients. I like to make sure the door is always open. )

I think their data is fairly accurate (or maybe 29% accurate) as most people are not going to call from of a facebook or Myspace page phone number if interested in an apartment. That's not the point and shouldn't be for a property/company's social media page/tool/account. A facebook page, etc. should most likely lead people to a company or property website where they find out more information and then contact the community through that source. People are going to dig deeper and will use multiple online sources when doing their homework.

The interesting statistic shared during that presentation is regarding their data only showing 29% of prospects being sourced correctly. We all know prospects use multiple sources when finding apartments and asking for and recording all sources on a guest card will always be a challenge (until we can read minds or record thoughts). Given that people use multiple sources, I think where the disconnect was for some at AIM was with the purpose of social media. Too many are viewing facebook, myspace, twitter, etc. as new FREE ILS-like sites where they can list their apartments and people will find them like Craigslist. WRONG! Social media sites are tools that are extensions of our websites, our brands, and our services. Just as Mr. Whaling and I discussed here http://www.theapartmentnerd.co...g-aim.html, social media should be viewed as a PR, Word-of-mouth, and Google Juice tools.

I could go on and on, but I'll let others voice their thoughts as well. Nice post Lisa!

Mj

Lisa-

I'm not suggesting that people believe social media sites are substitutes for ILS's, but that they treat them like an ILS or like Craigslist. The misconception is in the approach to using social media tools in general. Companies feel they need to push their message onto consumers. They assume that people are using facebook, Myspace, or Twitter to search for apartments just like they would on Craigslist or an ILS. That's not why people are logging into these sites. They are logging in to enhance their relationships with others. They want to learn and discover news and information on their own terms. Today in marketing, and in using social media, it's not about the push but more about the pull. How does the consumer pull your information via search or word-of-mouth recommendations? How do they discover you?

Social media is about being remarkable and sharing experiences. People update their status or upload photos as they have a story to tell, and it's an ever-changing dynamic story (at least in their eyes). If the most exciting story you have to tell about your company is what your new available apartments are then I don't think that's going to create much word-of-mouth.

This is really just my thoughts and opinion, and while we've made strides at J.C. Hart to utilize these tools I know we can do a much better job. The real challenge is in the time and investment. While the cost to create an account on these sites is $0 there is definitely an investment in time and effort that needs to be made to maximize them. I fully believe that the time dedicated to do so will give a much better ROI than using traditional marketing sources, but it must be done with the right intentions to maximize the results. We all have an opportunity to improve the service we deliver, improve the communication we have with our residents, and improve the experience our residents have with our brand using these tools. If we use them to just try and push our apartments on people then in my opinion that is wrong. And in the end, sites like facebook could be ruined with this type of use.

For some reason it's the goal of many to discover the cheapest silver bullet money can buy to market our products and services. Social media is definitely not the silver bullet of marketing, and potentially shouldn't really be considered marketing. Thoughts?

From skimming over the comments, let me know if I need to read them more carefully, the best use for social media sites right now is to drive leasing traffic to the community website (which should have more detail and functionality anyway). Also, for the purpose of evauluating ad sources, when dealing wiht so many ILS, social media and free internet listings like craigslist to me it seems the important number to follow is the amount of internet leads as a whole where generated.

In our portfolio, where we encounter the same challenges of accurately tracking ad sources, I can at least with more confidence evaluate our traffic sources as a whole by advertising medium. Having said that, the study reviewed at the aim confernence resembled our results. Interent traffic is by far our largest ad source with roughly 60% of tracked leads being sourced to the internet, print make up around 18%, locater services 2% and other organic traffic like lives in area, resident referal and signage makes up around 20%. My issues occur in the closing percentages. Internet is only capturing 7%, print 9%, locater services 27% and other 31%. Of course "other" includes walk-ins and my challenge has been to get our leasing agents to persue internet traffic just as aggressively as they track and persue people who they've encountered face to face.

As an industry we are great at the face to face relationship, not as good, but better over the phone and need a whole lot of work with building relationships via the internet. Up to now I've tried to solve this internet issue with a self service approach...giving the prospect the information and tools to see availability, make appointments and reserve an apartment on line, but in every scenario there has to be human interaction and service. We are good at tracking the internet activity, but not good at following up.

Oh, and please pardon my many typos...I raced through that one while I had fresh thoughts. Oh, initially I said social media's best use was to drive traffic to our community websites...at lease I meant that's pretty much as far as our company and most others seem to have gotten with the medium since we don't have the resources yet to keep it fresh, updated and engaging as we would like.

@ Lisa: I'm sure I qualify as one of the "devout SM believers" here, but I think there is a serious error being made by any business that is only applying marketing metrics to measure its success or failure in social media. If -- as Heather, the Nerd and others have referenced -- social media sites are just as useful for communicating with current residents, shouldn't we also be applying customer service and resident retention metrics to our efforts? Focusing on the wrong numbers is no better than ignoring the numbers altogether.

@ Matt: I wouldn't say that the best use for social media sites is to "drive leasing traffic to the community website" ... rather, I think it is to extend the brand message (not sales message; two very different things) beyond the website to other online communities where our current and prospective customers are already participating. I agree with you: we need to find ways to get better at following up, and fast ... the next lease might depend on how we respond to today's customer's (very public) question or complaint.

Hey Lisa,
I agree with your title, and think that more times than not, it will be deemed Social NotWorking. Property Management Companies will continue doing what they do, and doing it the way they always have, therefore proving out their own metrics. If the only marketing that XYZ Company does are ads in the local gazette, then, that must be what works and what draws traffic. Does it work because that is the most effective method of marketing or does it work because that is the way XYZ markets their product.

Add multiple places that XYZ markets, and each venue then has the need to prove why their marketing venue works best. Listening to metrics from the company asking for your business is similar to letting the Fox in the Hen House.

The other thing too is this, if I am a Regional Marketing Director, it is a heck of a lot easier to pick up the phone and place an order with one or all of the major ILS firms, and they likely will even take me out to lunch too. And, that probably works well enough. Having worked with several fine folks in that position, there are a zillion things pulling at their time, and the last thing they have time for is to implement a Social Media Strategy. And, then there is their Boss and their Bosses Boss standing over them with a machete for Head Whacking as soon as something doesn’t work so well. So, when we need more traffic, do more of what we are doing, lets not try anything new.

Here is another thing too with Social Media Marketing, but not so many folks believe it, you can stop doing a lot of what you are currently doing, and therein lies Huge Savings. Lastly, if I am turning my marketing dollars inward, I have also delighted our existing Resident Base, creating Compound Return.

Don't forget the IT department blocking access to social media locations, steaming video content and listig services like Craiglist. In the past, the marketing challenge has been exactly what Eric describes, now we have a new challenge and that's a overly protective IT department. Internet abuse does happen, but should we cut off all access to internet to resources?

I've also encountered generational hurtles...there are many in apartment marketing who live and die by brochures, open houses and direct mail. My goodness the money spent on these resources that are totally unproven to work, ask about the ROI on direct mail, but it's safe and those hatchet weilding bosses love to hear that we are doing direct mailings. Why? Social Media if done successfully opens doors that some just don't want to enter...some are not comfortable with real feedback and engagement.

But per the AIM conference study, we need to understand more about the dynamics of the apartment search process. I really want to find out if lives in area knows community, resident referral and signage really are our main drivers of leases! I get as frustrated as the next with all the marketing dollars wasted and getting the word of mouth result. Sometimes I want to say it's true and just not worry about it anymore. Someone talk me down.

All the data I have seen keeping pointing to the same conclusions with regard to social networking/social media in the Multifamily Industry: It's 95% effective for resident communication and retention, and 5% effective in attracting new leases.

So what's the most effective way to utilize this new tool? Absorb the conversation into your online presence and use the more popular sites to communicate news. You can have table top signage that advertises your Facebook page and/or Twitter page for updates, news and information regarding your community. Or, allow these conversations to be embedded into your various corporate or property level websites. Incorporating the ongoing dialogue into your site's search process just makes for even more qualified leads.

Since LT brought me into this, I guess I should respond (which is hard for me as I am typically very shy).

First, my comment about print sources being underweighted was in the context of using lead analysis to quantify ad source activity. I just wanted to make sure everyone understand the origin of the statement and most importantly, that this is my opinion and I do not have any data that supports this.

Which brings me to my next point… I read through the responses and there are many well thought out, intelligent opinions. Some of these opinions are likely correct while others may not be. The general point I always try and make when I speak is that the foundation for making advertising decisions should be based on as many facts as possible. Sometimes a good dose of common sense is needed when the data falls short of being complete, but when possible, you should not have an opinion or bias when making these decisions.

I think Heather’s comments have merit in that while there is no evidence of SM being a great aggregation tool today, it very may well be at some point in the future. Having an unbiased and digital way to interpret the changes will be essential as without this you would not know when to invest. My opinion is that without some search functionality, it will never be great but it could rise in popularity to the point of having some impact.

And this brings me to my final point. A few mentioned that people may see the property on SM but contact via the property’s web site. The same argument can be made for any of the ILS’s. The fact of the matter is that if contact information is present, at least some people would email or pick up the phone and dial from the Facebook, MySpace, etc. pages they are viewing. The fact that essentially none do this supports the conclusion that this medium is not viable for generating new leases at this time (but may be great for resident retention).

Archstone just launched an update that dynamically assigns tracking numbers on their web site based on the referring source (so a renter coming from Apartments.com will see a different tracking number then someone coming from Craig’s List). This will show how your property web site cannibalizes leads from the ILS’s and help determine their true value. The moral of the story is that despite this cannibalization, the ILS’s still show significant leads. The same would be true for SM if it worked.

866-440-8070 if you want to call and yell at me…

-Todd

Todd, you make some excellent points here that advertisers should definitely consider, and I think the dynamic phone number could provide some incredible results when used in conjunction with traditional website analytics.

However, we'll have to agree to disagree on one point -- I don't think a social media presence should be driven by advertising decisions. Certainly any marketing on these sites should complement a company's branding messages and current campaigns, but an ad-centric approach often overlooks opportunities to provide value to current residents -- which, as Robert has already referenced, may be where we find the greatest benefit for our businesses.

So who should make the investment decisions specific to resources allocated toward social media sites? Among marketers, there is an ongoing debate focusing on who should "own" social media within the organization. (Is it PR? Marketing? Advertising? Customer service?) It seems that our industry wants to default to advertising. While we obviously need to base our advertising investment decisions on the results produced from each outlet, our other business functions are missing opportunities if that's the sole driver that determines our participation in social networking sites.

I couldn't help myself; Social networking, Social Media, no matter what you call it...It takes a Village to create a Home. VW Bug driving, viral marketing, peer contributed content, "that's-what-she-said" referrals, corporate marketing, sharing a dogeared printed mag, a shared link, interactive gaming, Tweeting, Booking, Yammering, Spacing...whew! All of the above translate into informed ... prospects; informed prospects = QUALIFIED PROSPECTS. Consumer reviews are the same thing as resident referrals with a tweak; these days a review is shared with about 90 gajillion of one's closest friends at one time, online. Magazines and "collaborative discussions" AKA "word of mouth' work together to make people informed and engaged in their neighborhood. Maybe Mr. Rogers was tech-forward when he asked the question, "Won't you be my neighbor?" Maybe he was the originator of peer-contributed content. Cool...Mr. Rogers was wiki-fied. That just makes me smile. It's all about knowing and living in the Neighborhood that's right for you...or me.

Amen Tamela! Social networking is what we've always done...just not on the internet. The internet merely provides the tools and forum. Creating a sense of community, resulting in referrals and good word of mouth, may have more organic orgins that can't be stimulated, or replicated by management driven social media at least not yet. The real trick is to present these materials so the message does not appear to be dreamed up or edited by a marketing department...just let it live and grow on it's own. Letting social media go, like emotionally letting go of a kid off to college, is the hardest part. In the end, I think we will enjoy being empty nesters...think of all we can do with our free time!

Tamela, I have to disagree. Again, this is not based on actual data, but in my opinion, Mr. Rogers was a glue sniffing crack-head. You may be right about the other stuff, but not about Mr. Rogers.

I think people are reading my conclusions/recommendations incorrectly. Given the time and capability, I would use SM as a medium to communicate with existing residents as well as to try and aggregate new renters. But the reality is:
•60% of phone calls go to voice mail
•Only 40% of emails receive a response within 48 hours
•Very few communities maintain their Craig’s List advertisements properly (which produce the highest quality leads in our industry)
•More than 2/3 of all prospects never receive a follow-up call after their initial inquiry
•ILS’s often have incorrect rents because of not being updated properly or as often as needed
•Residents ending their lease terms are often not contacted until it’s too late
Given all of that (and a bunch of other items we could all add), I think it is unwise to commit the time and energy to SM when all of these other opportunities exist. It pains me to think that someone would spend an hour on Facebook while letting prospective renters go to voice mail and not calling the person who visited yesterday to see if they were ready to complete an application.

Like all things in life, you spend time doing the things that give you the greatest return. To date, there is not a shred of evidence that suggest SM would trump any of the items listed above. Until there is some evidence that your time spent with SM produces a higher return than other, proven methods, I would not make it a priority unless you are flushed with time on your hands and can’t decide what to do with it all.

-Todd

Todd, just maybe "Survey Says" we're ALL correct!
But the following 4 truths I hold to be self-evident;

Your President and mine refused to give up the his crackberry. He wanted to stay in the loop. He acknowledged as President-elect "...That, I think, was probably one of the biggest surprises of the campaign, just how powerfully our message merged with social networking and the power of the Internet."

Equally important on the world-stage, at the riveting American Idol season finale, when I noted on my Facebook page that glamrock Adam and Rod Stewart had my same hair, within 2 minutes I had a plethora of thumbs up and ROTFL responses from folks within the multi-family industry, and I'm talking about comments from the owner-manager side.

As a former leasing agent, anytime I received a resident referral, I did the extreme happy dance; that was almost always a guaranteed lease. The prospect was informed, qualified, had $$ burning a hole in his pocket and was not at the property to see the new drapes in the model apartment. Cha-ching.

As a mom of 27 and 25 and 15 and 12 year old people, I see that they do everything from chatting with BFF's, to learning to play guitar, to online banking to learning how to fix Mom's wi-fi tech problems AND looking for housing ALL powered by "the google machine" (to quote Will Farrell in Blade's of Glory). AND, now that I think on that...how many of us did NOT watch PEARL the LANDLORD courtesy of the YOUTUBE machine? And be honest...did you share it with someone? If not, shame on you. It was too hilarious to keep to yourself.

Maybe we can all agree on these things...Consumers of Social Media are no longer just the fellas sitting in the basement of mom's house hacking away into government computers trying to blow up the world (I love Die Hard movie themes). Bloggers and creators of Social Media don't always fact-check, but just like us on this Insider blog discussion, like it when they can have their opinion count; they like the control and instant gratification available in this forum and online; I mean after all, think like them "isn't everyone entitled to my opinion?"

Soooo, along with traditional avenues, why not use multiple vehicles and maybe get a "learners permit" to try out the emerging ones that so engage consumers on their own terms. You may just find that some of these tactics are VERY cost-effective and VERY high on the COOL scale with a growing consumer group.

Maybe we don't all know just how to use Social Media so well just yet. We're learning.

Heck, in some cases, it doesn't look like we know how to use traditional media options so well either. Just listening to actual phone conversations from objective calltracking companies between leasing agents and interested apartment shoppers can make that big vein on my forehead pop out. We don't always excel at tracking traffic sources nor does really listening to the caller rate highly up there, either. But again...we're learning.

Open communication does pose risks and reaps rewards in different ways than other forms of the push-out marketing message. The thinskinned of us Marketing Types may not always be thrilled with some of the "blasts" received in such an open forum, but you know...why wait to join in the conversation? Apartment-shopping-type-folks are out there talking about us apartment mangement-type-folks, maybe we can help to reform their opinion by jumping into the dialogue.

I will always buy my fresh monthly print copy of Rolling Stone (and I whined when the large format was changed), BUT, I also check out RollingStone.com, Spin.com, DaveFM.com and ITunes commentaries about the latest and greatest jam sessions.

Bottom line, Social Media = Engaging in Conversation.
Engaging in Conversation = Communication.
Communication = Sharing.
Sharing is Good.
And now we're back to Mr. Rogers. It IS a beautiful day in the Neighborhood, Todd. And don't confuse Mr. Rogers with Mr. Greenjeans.

Todd, Hello,
If I correctly understand what you are articulating with your comment, is that basically our industry sucks at managing apartments, and we are at best a mediocre commodity. What you have outlined are the very basics of property management. Perhaps mediocre property management companies, which are merely a commodity, should well follow your outline in order to achieve the most bang for their buck in terms of time resource.

And, by the way, I generally agree with what you have said, and I expect you have data to back it up. That being said, our industry must strive to get past the basics, and look to Create Remarkable and Re-Invent the space we play in, by Creating an Experience for the Resident that is worth talking about, and is far superior to mediocre, because when you do that, this industry is no different that any other, you get significantly more in rent than the guy across the street and are able to pay investors an enhanced return.

I can tell you from first hand experience, effective use of Social Media will very quickly tell you exactly where you are dropping the ball, and is laced with a wonderful opportunity to fire incompetent staff quicker and create Resident Evangelists along the way. Further, Social Media is an excellent resource to Break From the Pack of Apartment Commodity.

Present company excluded, but it seems that people have made their careers out of managing mediocrity. To some it's job security to have to trouble shoot all the challenges that Todd outlined. Funny thing is no one ever seems to come up with any solutions that are different. Social Media really is the perfect tool to measure a property's resident pulse and staff performance, but most in this industry do not feel comfortable with letting the resident evangelists genie out of the box. Having seen it happen time and time again, the you know what flows down and it's usually the site managers and staff who take the brunt of bad business decisions made by those in decision making positions, or angry residents who may have broken the rules but were not accomodated. Social media feedback, the public forum, may also call to attention bad business practices that often go ingnored until it's too late. Sometimes we need courage, leadership and a buck stops here attitude when things go wrong. Eric is right that the social media forum can provide that kind of feedback, as long as it is used for good and not evil. Which reminds me it's time to embrace apartmentratings.com as an on the table means to measure customer service, not something from which to hide and fear.

I think that this statistic "Social Media sources (YouTube, Twitter, MySpace and Facebook) accounted for .05% of all leads for their test properties used in the presentation." is sooooo low because I have yet to see a property that is utilizing twitter effectively. Twitter is not a billboard or a place to blast the newest listing. Twitter has been effective in driving traffic and business in other industries but the multi-family community is a bit behind and lacking on the know how to make these vehicles work effectively - IMHO.

I agree with the statement that with regards to social networking/social media in the Multifamily Industry: It's 95% effective for resident communication and retention, and 5% effective in attracting new leases.

Social Media is not yet at a point where it is effective at driving new residents rather, the purpose of participating should be looked at as a channel to provide the community an opportunity to engage with and converse with their residents.

Today, Social Media such as Facebook, MySpace and Twitter provide a community a wonderful way to provide their residents up to date news and information, as well as addressing anything that might be filtering throughout your community.

@Todd: I think you're correct when you estimate that only 40% of emails receive a response within 48 hours. Here's how I fixed that: I bought a cheap automated email response software program. When Jane Smith emails us at 3:02 a.m., within 1 second she receives an automated email response, loaded with photos.

In addition, this response shows her all the different ways she can gain more information about our property while waiting for our phone call (e.g., Facebook page, photos at Flickr, Photostream and Picasa, virtual video tours at Picasa and YouTube, our profile on our ILS, Google Profile, out bookmarks on Del.icio.us, how to follow us on Facebook, connect on LinkedIn, etc.).

Our automated email response program is not only valuable after business hours, but is critical when our leasing staff is so busy there are times they may not be in front of their computer all day.

Rick Hevier

I'm going to sidestep the larger discussion and just toss out one additional use for SM - insight generation. Though I think the chatter around specific community or mgmt co. brands is going to be minimal, there are lots of folks talking about their rental search and overall experiences as a renter. This is true at a market level too, meaning there is a fairly hefty about of data out there in any sizable area in which you have a community.

Anyone who's ever tried their hand at market research knows this is a terrific resource of unfettered insight. If you do nothing more than use SM to uncover renters' stories, I think this is still a big win.

I'm going to come at this issue from a very basic level. I like the concept and application of social media. Although more impersonal than some would like, it FEELS more personal. I like the immediate and constantly streaming level of feedback that my manager can manage. I, too, have heard waaaaay too many individuals verbalize their fear and subsequent no-vote to sm items like apartmentratings.com... the fear is from the inability or unwillingness to legitimize it.
For me, is social media the end all and be all? No, but who's to say it can't be. Learn it, don't fear it. My problem is that there is too much to learn and constantly evolve with to stuff into the few minutes i have every day to dedicate to my social media educaition.
I AM gaining leads from it. Though they are few, they are there. Which i will take at every chance.
The application abilities to further enmesh my properties as communities is fascinating and exciting.
But that's just my take. No training in marketing... mostly application experience.

@Todd: your observations about the failure of leasing staff to promptly respond to emails, phone calls, followup of leads, etc. is really an indictment of MANAGEMENT.

We have 346 apartments, two full-time leasing persons, and an annual turnover rate of apartments of about 28%. One leasing person is dedicated to responding to about 1,400 emails, phone calls, walk-in traffic and their followup. These result in a substantial number of showings, then applications and finally leases. The other leasing person is dedicated to allowing the primary leasing person to focus on leasing by taking care of the office/accounting functions, helping to process some 2,500 customer service requests, and assists in leasing when possible. This results in a truly team effort. Therefore, abandon the lease bonus system, which breeds a competitive, anti-collaboration atmosphere, and instead, foster an environment of collaboration among the leasing staff (research Dr. Deming, deming.org).

We need to increase the pay of leasing and maintenance staff, and then find people who fit the higher pay. In our area we pay some of the highest rates for maintenance and leasing staff. What it buys us is longevity of employee service, what it saves us is the upfront and hidden costs of employee turnover, what it gets us is higher quality personnel.


If emails go unanswered, phone calls go to voice mail, inadequate followup, etc., these are not the fault of the office staff, but are the FAILURE of management to provide the necessary manpower, other resources, and an effective system for success. This is why effective managers are "systems analysts" - they devise and manage systems, even when managing people.

Rick Hevier

@Lisa: I agree that it is difficult to assess the lead source, especially since social media and other internet methods have complicated that assessment. This is why effective training of leasing staff in drilling down to the best lease source for each prospect is critical, which we do from the initial moment of contact.

We are obsessive about tracking the source of our inquiries. Our staff understands that decisions on our marketing methods are being made based on that data. Even though it is difficult to do so, we have no choice.

Rick Hevier

@Lisa: Those who view the "social media" (SM) as a time waster, are destined to miss this train as it leaves the station. Pursue these methods, gain confidence in their use and explore ways to exploit their application.

While most people in our business are trying to figure out how to get to first base by understanding Twitter, Eric Brown of Urbane is rounding 3rd base, with innovative ways to engage his customers and his surrounding community, building a network of what he calls "resident evangelists".

Eric is exploring cutting-edge approaches and uses of SM. Follow his progress on his Urbane blog and look at the scope of applications he has developed and his experiments. In many ways, he must feel like the first pioneers of radio or television in marketing felt like.

One website is consuming as much as 6% of all time that Americans spend on the internet - Facebook. Craigslist and Ebay are the bane of a shrinking news print business, even the vaunted Washington Post and New York Times.

There will be detractors, but in the end, we diminish this new technology at our peril.

Rick Hevier

@Russell: I think we will miss the marketing surge of the social media methods if we narrow its application to communication with current customers.

Our ILS's drive email and telephone traffic to our office. Then, we drive this email traffic to our various social media sites with our automated email response system that I described above. This means that by the time our leasing staff reaches prospective customers by telephone, they've already been largely "sold" on our property.

We use Flickr, Photostream and Picasa to deliver photos; YouTube and Picasa to deliver virtual video tours. We use our blog, Deli.cio.us bookmarks, our public Google calendar, Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn to deliver more detailed information.

What Eric Brown is doing is taking the SM beyond delivering mere information, and is scaling it to engage his customers and his surrounding community, creating "evangelists" for his business in the process.

Rick Hevier

@Elysa: take a look at the marketing strides being made by Eric Brown of Urbane and his innovative uses of social media methods and other internet technology. Follow him on Twitter, his blog, Facebook to gain a sense of a new way of thinking about the uses of these methods.

Rick Hevier

Hey Rick. Forgive me if you thought I was beating up on the property staff – I wasn’t. When you staff communities at 1 – 1.5 FTE’s per 100 units, you are going to miss phone calls and emails, not have time to follow-up, etc. I don’t think it’s a failure of management either– it’s just how the staffing model works and it has its limitations.

Given that, I think spending time on SM at the further expense of missed phone calls and emails is not the right choice. Again, I have seen a dozen emails today about how great SM is, but not a shred of evidence that it helps aggregate new renters.

I love Facebook and have a great time with it. There is no denying its critical impact on society. The question becomes is it a good tool to help find an apartment. So far, the answer is no (or at least no one has produced anything scientific that refutes this statement). As far as interacting with existing residents, I think it’s a great idea and something everyone should do assuming that it is the highest and best use of their limited time. You also have to wonder why some of the largest and most respected companies in our industry researched SM and decided not to engage.

I would love for someone to show me actual data on why my conclusions are incorrect. At AIM, I saw Mike’s presentation and while they are doing some great things at Urbane (I absolutely loved the whole manikin thing), there was no data to suggest that SM has an impact on leasing velocity.

-Todd

Like Mark, I originally intended to skirt to main thrust of this conversation but I think a couple key points are worth adding to the discussion.

For legit reasons, much of the ROI related talk here is around the types of hard data Level One (and the national rental sites - is it sacrilege that I cringe at the term ILS??) provide. Any good marketer, the folks in their c-suite and BOD strive for such metrics to make sound budgeting decisions. I think it's even reasonable to aspire to such metrics for certain SM efforts where an immediate call to action is present.

That said, I think we sometimes lose sight of the fact that building brand equity can be an equally compelling objective and it's not uncommon for such initiatives to have little direct connection to a "lead." In my experience, many mgmt co's place a great deal of emphasis on creating an understandable brand promise that differentiates their communities at a brand/mgmt co level. If this is true for your mgmt co, then it's not at all unreasonable to measure SM success in terms of "softer" metrics such as brand awareness, preference, WOM, etc.

In the case of Urbane, even here in Chicago some of the Detroit-area transplants I know and have asked about Urbane can speak to some of the elements of their brand promise. I'm sure Eric would be quick to say this gives him a leg up vs. competition for his renter target. He may not be able to turn every brand aware renter into a lead (based on more pragmatic considerations like price, location, amenities, etc.) but vs. a prop with similar attributes, I'd say he has a marked advantage.

I may have turned this comment into more of a case for brand marketing, but I think the connection to SM is clear. The Internet is a wonderful, measurable ecosystem that we all expect to be able to deconstruct into a fantastic dashboard to measure marketing performance. We should try, whenever relevant and possible, to track our efforts, but I think when in comes to spending time engaging people in an online social sphere, it's important to take a step back from a lead generation mindset and begin to think about how your efforts impact brand.

To clarify, I'm only really referring here to what may fall under the umbrella of SM marketing. As others have mentioned, there's plenty to focus on in the realm of existing tenant relationship mgmt, service, etc. that don't fit the mold of outbound marketing. And, to draw from one of Lisa's earlier comment, this says nothing of social media that aren't Twitter/Facebook like reviews, ratings, online communities built around your props, etc. In my opinion, breaking down the barriers of resistance to this honest dialogue with renters/tenants has far more potential for positive impact to those willing to participate than any Facebook/Twitter outreach efforts.

Wow, This thread really took off, our hats off to Lisa for inspiring a great conversation. Thank you to Rick and Tim for the nice comments. I am humbled by all of the Urbane reference, thank you all very much, even if you are arguing against our ideas. We have worked hard to Break From the Pack of Apartment Commodity.

Tim, You bring up an excellent point regarding Brand Awareness. We have focused most of our marketing budget and intent on Creating a Brand. I have no idea which metrics to believe regarding the various ILS, Print or any other Advertising Medium. Almost everyone agrees that at best, they are 30% accurate as to where the lead comes from. Not a great math there. Frankly, who cares anyway, and why are we spending so much time worrying about data that is 70% wrong? And, to Mark's on going point, what about the Quality of Leads?

Instead, why aren’t Property Management Companies more focused on their Google Ranking. It is amazingly easy to gauge and check. Just Google your name, which will give an accurate sense of your Brand Awareness. Google Urbane Apartments and we dominate the first 7-10 pages. Social Media is the key resource we have used to gain that ranking, NOT Traditional Marketing, Print or ILS Advertising. Heck, Urbane comes up mid page, Page One even when you Google just the word Apartments.

BTW, I get the argument that Lisa brings up about REITS and Fee Managed PM Companies challenges and constraints, but what about the rest of the lot? Most Property Management Companies could create Brand Awareness, but they don’t, therefore they get little to no Google Juice.

According to lots of data, not produced by the Fox in the Hen House, 70% of folks start their purchase on line with a Google Search. That’s a pretty big number. So, why don’t Property Management Companies focus on where they rank on a Google Search for say Apartments (Your City) in a Google Search. Again, it is pretty darned easy to check. I check our ranking for Apartments Royal Oak every day, and we consistently come up Page One, Number One to Three at the top page, organically, most of the time in front of the ILS guys. I have always banked on the idea that if we could get the prospect to our Urbane Website first or faster, we can immediately begin to Enhance the Prospects Experience.

In my opinion, it is just a whole lot easier to place your ads with the ILS services than it is to practice Social Media, which is why I think most folks stay that course. As an example, how many companies are changing their web site copy regularly, monthly, or even weekly? At Urbane, we change copy daily, and BTW, we aren’t all that tech savvy either, you don’t need to be, just need to be focused on a different result. We can change copy daily because we have NO Corporate babble to wade though, which too, is what stifles Social Media, because you don't get to Control the Message, but you do Get to Participate in the Conversation via SM

@Lisa, @Todd: If I'm understanding you correctly, your concern is that the time demands of SM are not offset with a benefit that can be measured, particularly when other tasks that have a measurable benefit are left undone (return voice mail, emails, follow-up, etc.).

Todd correctly noted that a lot of marketing dollars are being wasted because of an inability to take advantage of what they produce. As systems analysts, management carries responsibility for making system improvements to avoid this kind of wasteful outcome. I agree that these other tasks MUST be a accomplished, but they should not be mutually exclusive with SM marketing.

Before discounting the utility of SM marketing, consider the following:

(1). There can be a synergistic relationship between ILSs and SM. It's difficult to match the SEO power of ILSs (although Urbane has succeeded in "page one" google status because of its SM initiatives). Smart ILSs, will find ways to integrate SM into their services (e.g., note Apartment Finder's upcoming initiatives).

(2). In order to exploit the potential and power of SM, we need to embrace and explore and, as Trekkies would understand, mind-meld with SM. It is quickly evolving and becoming highly competitive. Facebook's attempt to become a single source "portal" sucking up vast amounts of the consumer's internet life is a threat to all internet sites. Nielson Online reported in February that "Member Communities", i.e., SM and blogs, have now surpassed email, with mobile phones driving the surge. Twitter real-time conversation search is emerging as a potential threat to Google's website search, which Google acknowledges. "Google Wave" is recognition that it faces an impending SM tsunami, and they ignore it at their own peril.

(3). Businesses of all types are trying to learn how consumers use SM and how to exploit that reality. This is where Eric Brown's experience in the apartment business should be studied. As to the scalability of our experience and Urbane's experience when compared to major private and REIT apartment owners, prominent corporations in America are joining the stampede - the New York Times' announcement of a corporate-level position solely dedicated to SM means that the newspaper industry has no other choice but to acknowledge this New World.

(4). Become an early "adopter" and early "adapter". The history of business is littered with the skeletons of companies that failed to understand new technology and how to adapt to a changing world. It's not quite the same as being Christopher Columbus, but we need to explore this New World, even though it demands more of our time.

Large apartment owners probably realize that have no choice but to embrace, explore and make a SIGNIFICANT SM commitment - their competition will.

Rick Hevier

Tim and Eric, I think you guys are on the right track with the way this conversation should be going. Social media should be about the brand and not about advertising. Using the measures and metrics of tracking (like we do with the ILSs or print) to justify social media will never really work. For some reason the word "marketing" has been tacked onto the end of social media and people misunderstand its use to be for advertising. And because its use should NOT be to accomplish advertising, "Scientist" marketers get all bent out of shape about justifying the return while "Artist" marketers embrace it. See Seth's post about Is Marketing an Art or a Science. http://sethgodin.typepad.com/s...ience.html

Many of us in marketing must wear both hats, and, like Seth, I believe it's good practice to do so. From the "Scientist" perspective many are focusing on the wrong concept for what to measure. Eric hit home with what the best measurement is ... Google. From a scientific marketing viewpoint social media should be measured by Google Juice, page rankings, and pages with search. Use all the analytics tools offered (many are free) to measure the success of your web pages, search results, and traffic. That's the science part of using social media. With social media and branding, however, I believe those days are the ones to put on the "Artist" hat. How you use the social media tools to help brand our communities takes an artistic approach that can't really be measured today, but over time (if done right) will help you grow your presence with the measurables.

One final thought as well in regards to scalability. 75% of management companies have less than 3000 units (Fleishman-Hilliard International Communications). Social media can be used for the majority in our industry to help propel them and compete with the larger brands. Just look at what Eric's done as an example. Public companies and those doing Fee Management do have a lot of work to do to help justify investments in social media, however, just look at what Eric has done with his Google results and count up the $ he saves by not doing Pay-Per-Click or using any ILSs. It will take work and scientific measurement of results are needed to help justify the expenses for many, but nobody ever said marketing was easy. Buying a print ad is easy, paying for an online listing is easy, but creating an online environment and brand that allows your customers to recommend you and participate in conversations with you online, that's remarkable. Easy doesn't last and help build a brand. Where is the pet rock today? Remarkable is the way to go.

[I apologize in advance to Lisa for, what she considers, my obsession with Seth Godin. I don't embrace all of his ideas and thoughts, but this just fit so well in here I couldn't resist.]

@Tim: brilliant analysis.

@Mark: I agree with much of what you wrote, however, I think you limit the potential for SM marketing if you see that "its use should NOT be to accomplish advertising." There's no question that SM marketing serves to help build brand awareness. But this is only 50% of the equation.

As I noted in my comments above, our ILSs drive email traffic to us, which, in turn, we instantaneously then drive to our SM sites: within one second of any time day or night, a prospective customer who emails us receives an automated email response with a panoply of SM sources for more multimedia information about our property.

Because we use bit.ly links, we can generate important metrics analysis as feedback to the efficacy of this approach - relying on toll-free numbers to track leads is becoming old technology.

And, as I noted, the benefits of automated response technology encompasses more than non-business hours, because we can more quickly respond to prospective customers than our competition even during busy work days, like the beginning of the month cycle. Besides, by the time we connect by a telephone call, much of the sales heavy lifting has been accomplished!

BTW, our automated email response software cost about $50 and takes virtually no time to maintain.

Rick Hevier

@Lisa: Your point about the difficulty of "scaling" the kinds of SM marketing performed by Urbane and others to large property owners and fee management companies seems to be related to the difficulty in quantifying ROI and the impact on NOI to Wall Street types.

Short-term thinking has led us to GM - Government Motors, Inc., which had the best and the brightest of Harvard, Yale and Princeton MBAs, many of whom concocted a scheme of derivatives and securitized toxic loans that nearly capsized the world economy. Now, GM will have the oversight of the best and brightest of government bureaucracy

Sitting on top of the remaining heap of the world's largest manufacturers is Toyota, which is the product of the System of Profound Knowledge devised by Dr. Deming (google "toyota" and "deming", or visit deming.org).

There is a long, current thread on the W. Edward Deming LinkedIn group trying to explain this question: why has Deming not been embraced by American companies in the way it has elsewhere, such as Japan and India?

Short-term thinking must be at the core of Doug Miller's observation (SatisFacts Research group) that the average annual apartment turnover, according to the NAA, is about 60%. I don't know how an apartment property company can make a profit with an average 60% turnover rate! Our 10 year annual average is about 28%, which is not entirely satisfactory.

Let's hope that the best and the brightest in the apartment business develop an understanding of Deming's System of Profound Knowledge, otherwise, we are doomed to repeat the mistakes of quarterly thinking.

Rick Hevier

I have always wondered about the 60% turnover percentage number myself. What a strain on a community to have to turn over 60%...last year ours was 44% and I thought that was too high! Anyway...I really do like the point about challenging our business model. Our industry loses a lot of good people because of low pay, stress and sometimes lack of innovation. All the new tools we are discussing that will engage prospects and residents are changing how we think about operations and marketing. I agree, that our industry spends too much money on employee turnover and sometimes too much money to retain mediocre employees because of the years of experience those individuals may have. The cost of mediocrity as it is applied to resident turnover, poor customer service and poor employee retention is a not so well tracked number. Why not take a chance with investment in new talent, even recruiting highly motivated individuals from other industries who see the advantages of innovation and are hungry to show results is worth considering. A property manager, leasing agent, or maintance person with years of real estate management experience and a history of bouncing from property to property does not rank high on my list. Bad habits are impossible to break, and of course social media has the potential to bring these bad habits to a new light...the feedback is a "be careful what you wish for" scenario.

@Lisa: what I meant by 800 numbers being "old technology" is that with the internet there are now click-through ways to track leads, such as bit.ly tiny url links, for purposes of metrics analysis and tracking leads as a result of our automated email response system. The advantage of these click-through tracking methods is that they don't rely on a person's memory as to the lead source.

There's no question that telephone leads have a higher value than email leads - witness, for example, the national launch this week by Rent.com of their new service incorporating telephone lead contact.

Rick Hevier

@Matt: I agree that it makes no sense to hire people with long-term experience at doing things wrong. Raising pay for maintenance and leasing staff, and then finding people that fit the new pay scale, will hopefully serve a purpose of gaining employees who make long-term commitments to the business, with a knowledge of the property and its systems that converts to higher customer satisfaction.

@Rick I tested your auto-email and I'm now stumped. I don't see how your use of all these sites is "social" in any way, nor do I see how they help to benefit you in a Google search. Just by typing in "Kings Gate West Apartments" only one result on page one was a website you control. Type in "Urbane Apartments" or "J.C. Hart Apartments" and let me know what you find in comparison. With what you are doing on all these sites it seems that all the same information could be better displayed on just one website.

I'm not saying that your automated response system isn't a great idea, I just don't believe that what you are doing with the social media sites is helping you accomplish what you may think you are accomplishing. You are still relying heavily on the ILSs to bring you traffic and that's advertising. Then from there you are just redirecting people to information on a gazillion different websites that could easily be condensed into one place.

What Eric and I are trying to accomplish is building organic search results and word-of-mouth that do not require us to spend as much money with pay-per-click, the guides, and ILSs. That is the power of social media. Eric has even taken it to the next level with the way he uses the tools to communicate with his residents.

I think what you have built could be extremely powerful, but needs to be redirected a bit. Do you have a main website or is it just the blog? It appears what you are doing is using these sites in an effort to create pages that could just be on a single website. That could be a budget thing, but even your blog could be enhanced to essentially have a free website. You're getting there, but I'm sticking w/ my statement that social media should 100% NOT be advertising. It may be a function of marketing, customer service, PR, and/or branding, but NOT advertising.

@Mark: One of the benefits that I've gained from Multifamily Insiders is learning new concepts, such as Eric's thrust that optimizing google search ranking reaches those people who use Google, and how his use of SM helps him succeed in this his rankings. I think what you and Eric are working on is clearly a pathway for this business.

But, I think you may be confused as to how our automated email response system works for us. We are driving traffic to those places on the internet where consumers are "living". For example, Flickr, Photostream, Picasa, YouTube and Facebook are important places where people share photos and videos with friends and the world. Facebook hosts something like 15 billion photos alone.

When we drive people to our photos, videos and info in these places, we can become part of their world in a way that is much different and easier for them than a proprietary website, because we are also INTEGRATED into that same site. By the time we have a telephone conversation, much of the sales work has been done!

Further, when we offer consumers a plethora of sources through our email response, we make it quicker and easier for them to choose those places where they are active, and it's all laid out in a simple email letter format.

Finally, with our automated email response, we can reach our prospective customers instanteously no matter the time of day or how busy our leasing staff is. This gives us a decisive, competitive edge, because we are there quickest.

How do I know it works for us? In 2008, our leads surged more than 30% from 2006. We are nearly 100% occupied, are able to be selective and reject about 1/3rd of applicants - and we've been RAISING rents. In 2008, we had the best year in more than 20 years for vacancy months.

In today's and last year's economy, I really don't know how many apartment properties are achieving those kind of results, but I think you'll have to agree that it's probably not very many. Do these results mirror what your properties been experiencing?

Rick Hevier

@Rick Let's go back to how Lisa started this conversation. "Should we call it Social NOTworking?" From my perspective what you (and many others) are doing is not necessarily online social networking. However, what you are doing seems to be working for you. I think it is great that you are utilizing these essentially free resources to place your content and information. I also think it's great that you have automated your email responses and that you have seen improved results due to that process. I am not criticizing you for any of that, and I think your results are fantastic.

What is working for you is not social networking in my opinion, but your email response system and the response to your ILS listings. From what I can see those pieces are really what is helping you generate leads and leases. I consider what you are doing just use of social media websites in place of a traditional website. That's just Online Marketing, and I believe could be accomplished with 1 main website containing all that information. Your social media sites would be an extension of that 1 site creating Google Juice and truly giving you the opportunity to "network" with the online community of residents and prospects. All of this can help you reduce spending with the print guides, ILSs, pay-per-click, or other advertising because of the organic results you get from online searches and social media networking.

The reason many companies are failing or not seeing results with Social Networking and Social Media is because they are just creating pages (and maybe because they don't automate their email responses with such sophistication). This is why it's not working. It's not even really working from a "social" perspective for J.C. Hart that well, but we are getting some great Google Juice out of using the tools and we're in a great position to make it more social. With our efforts we have even eliminated print advertising for nearly all our communities resulting in huge cost savings. It's been hard to try and catch up to Eric, but he's had a great head start.

I think you are in a great position to make your presence more social as well. Like I said before, with just a little redirection, what you have done can be even more powerful.

As for your question about results mirroring yours, I can't say we're comparing apples to apples really without learning more about your property/company. I applaud you for your achievements. I can tell you we have been very happy with our results this past year with revenue continuing to grow vs. 2008 (even in a so-called declining market).

Wow. I love the thoughtfulness and passion around this topic, it tells me that something is brewing. Maybe not in its current incarnation, but it's brewing. The data isn't there yet, but the data wasn't there about email in 1998 either. Somehow we all use it without knowing what the ROI is.

The one thing that strikes me reading this thread is how narrowly social media are defined. As someone who uses Yelp to find businesses and read reviews about them in advance, I believe that ratings-driven listing sites will have a high degree of utility, broad acceptance and lots of built-in traffic. Maybe social isn't about Friendster and Facebook. Maybe ratings on a trusted site or sites will be the killer app.

One thing is for certain - AIM Conference attendees who didn't sneak out early heard the news that Google has started putting ratings from social sites into the first page of the search results. I've already noticed ratings from Yelp.com show up when I search on a business name. Even if social isn't here quite yet, it's about to be forced on the industry by Google. The task for ILS sites isn't to hide behind their existing model, it's to use jiu jitsu and leverage the social sites and social functionality for cheaper, more targeted traffic.


This whole debate kind of reminds me (as a professional photographer) of the debate about whether digital cameras were better than film. When Canon, Nikon, Sony, Olympus and Hasselblad realized there was more money in digital than in their traditional film cameras the whole "debate" went away. With 40,000 multifamily firms out there, some people are going to figure out things earlier than others. Do we really need conformity of opinion about a topic that is already so broad that no one is really even talking about the same things?

We're still only talking about clunky adaptations of consumer entertainment platforms for multifamily? What happens when Yelp.com wakes up, buys AptRatings, and starts integrating rental specific functionality? And they always show up on the first page of Google search results? What if Google decides that they want to monetize real estate search better and do the same thing? It's still early folks. It's still early.

Awesome conversation, Lisa. Who knew a little 150 word post could spark such an amazing conversation that goes above and beyond the original subject? I guess asking the multifamily industry what we think of social networking is kind of like asking beauty queens what they think of civil rights and foreign policy. We are all critics and very few are experts…I know I’m certainly not. That’s exactly with Miss Teen SC has over 35 million views on YouTube (http://bit.ly/1080b) So, my answer to this is…I don’t have the “right” answer, but I am confident and pleased with the results we are achieving.

There’s a whole lot on this page about a variety of subjects, but I’m going to stick to just a few:

Measuring ROI: Anyone that thinks they can measure 100% accurately on any source 100% of the time is clearly crazy and should be beaten with a heavy stack of lease paperwork and run over with a golf cart. Safety first, of course. Prospects do not care how they found you. And newsflash…leasing consultants kinda don’t care about sourcing right all the time either. So until the day everything is what I call “automagic” (automatic), let’s recognize the variance of data that we all share for what its worth and train, train, train.

Social NOTworking: You decide. I think it’s ok to say “yes” and “no,” just try it and pick one. I for one believe in the power of word of mouth and see great value is how that translate across key performance indicators through the internet. Be advised that social media is not free. There are risks, hard costs, soft costs, blah, blah, blah. But it “ain’t” free.
Do I think our properties are getting tons of leads and leases based purely on social sites?
Absolutely not.
Do I think we are going to keep doing it?
Absolutely.
Do we have some properties that get more leases off social sites than some paid media?
Yes- not a lot, but some.
Do I get employee leads, investor leads, and resident communication weekly via social sites?
Heck yes and I love it.

Communication vs. Connectivity: Recognize the difference. If you are doing social media to get leases, then just stop. STOP. If you’re doing it because you think you have to, stop. If you’re doing it cause everyone else is, stop. Do it because you and your customers (be it residents, prospects, employees, investors…) have found value. Social media is the opposite of push advertising. Everyone has read all the hot “web 2.0” lingo with words like “conversation,” “engage,” etc. The properties we have that are finding success are asking questions, posting relevant hyper-local info, engaging with prospects/residents/local hot spots, etc. I agree with Heather and MBJ- this is about retention and PR. It’s about your brand.

Social Networking-Shmetworking. One size does not fit all. AND- it’s not just limited to the main sites everyone talks about. Take a look at your entire online brand experience.

Mixed Bag: I guess maybe I have a unique perspective with this. For Bell, we own some assets. Manage some. Own part of some. We have multifamily communities, senior living communities, and commercial assets. We have funds and individual owners and partners. We are also a private, family-owned company. We have over 5.5 billion dollars worth of real estate and are fairly large by comparison. We have a mixed bag of needs and thrive on client satisfaction. Most of you on this page fall in one of those categories and we need to decide what unique blended approach works best for each of us. None of our “marketing” eggs are all in one basket because that approach does not fit our business model.

@Steve
Nail on head, buddy. Completely agree with these statements:
1.“It's still early folks. It's still early.”
2.“Do we really need conformity of opinion about a topic that is already so broad that no one is really even talking about the same things?”

We have just begun to round 1st base with the power of the internet with so much more to come. Are we ready? So…my post in 5 five words: Fail fast and try again.

If you don't mind, I'd like to share my "I'm actually a resident" perspective about a few of these specific online venues.

RATING SITES
I'm with Steve. Go with ratings sites like Yelp.com and even apartmentratings.com. If blog writers responding to blogs is so valuable, don't we have the opportunity to respond to resident posts good and bad with grace and poise? My husband actually chose to send me to a local spa from a ratings site because the owner responded personally to all comments good or bad. And most of them were good. You will have to overcome the automatic distrust of the manager, but the best way to do so is to not be defensive.

MY VOTE?--Do it...if you can do it well!

FACEBOOK
As an avid user of facebook, the only way I'll find any information is if my friends are directly connected. I have too many friends to keep up with to go looking for other events/causes/networks in facebook. I might, just might, see something on the side that someone "liked" or became a "fan" of, but the chances of me clicking on that are next to none.

Also, many are getting wise to the possibility that people may actually look at your pictures and check your status update. So "friending" your local apartment community might not always be the best idea. Especially if you didn't pay for two pet deposits, and your status update often talks about your two big dogs. Having connected with many of my fellow residents and then becoming friends on facebook, I have found out many things they wouldn't want our manager to know.

MY VOTE: Is it worth the time? Probably not. I just think there must be something we can do better.

TWITTER
I agree that getting tweets about your property are great, but getting residents and their friends "following" your properties' tweets is a a huge challenge. It would have to be something pretty amazing, like "Come on down to the clubhouse. Cookies are warm and fresh." Or "Firing up the grill for our resident bbq today! Are you coming?" I especially like the first because it is something that isn't advertised anywhere else. Twitter would be the exclusive host of this information.

In fact, did you know that a bakery, I believe somewhere in the UK, started doing this whenever new batches or new products were hot out of the oven. Whenever they tweeted, they would be sold out of that product in a very short time through phone orders and stop-bys. That's amazing to me. However, be realistic...apartment homes and freshly baked, hot out of the oven bread is not the same thing.

MY VOTE: Sure! Yet again, if not done well, will absolutely waste too much of your time. My opinion is to focus on current residents first.

MY NUTSHELL OPINION/DEFINITION: Social Networking is about finding your fans, and letting them spread the word, whether it is online or just down at the local Starbucks or Moms Group. Decide what your target market is and prioritize well. You HAVE to do a lot of other forms of marketing, but only do social marketing if it is truly beneficial (facebook, twitter, etc., not including ratings sites). And take good care of those fans, a.k.a. residents. Do so, and they will be fans for life with or without tweets.

I know I'm jumping in here a little late...ok really late, but I think that while many like to sit here and debate whether social media works or not, they might find it profitable to try it out. I can assure you that sitting here reading and debating isn't going to get you more leases yet you still try it.

In reference to Todd's results, I think that there have not been enough people trying SM to call it quality data. People are too hesitant. Are those who are using SM doing it well? Maybe. I can say that not enough are. I have seen some do it extremely well. If I were looking for an apartment in those areas, I would definitely be interested. SM hasn't really matured in the apartment industry yet. So, I don't really think it is fair to give an assessment based on its use currently. That's like saying the GUI (Graphical User Interface) would fail on the computer. Ha! There are too many who want to sit here and discuss and not enough who are brave enough to just try. What are you going to do, fail? Just try to do it well. Todd is right by saying that if you aren't taking calls, you shouldn't be trying something else. That should be a given though.

I'm just saying, I think we're all smart. And as this ongoing discussion continues to ferment, we can all taste the brew and have different impressions.

Lefko's reference to early camera equipment being "clunky" is right. We're social-media "Clunky".
It's been fun to go back and read our conversation posts from earlier this year and see the constant growth that has ocurred in this space.

The Apartment Industry's Social Media savvy will grow up from "Clunky" to "Graceful"someday. Maybe in a galaxy far, far away.

And we'll do that by joining and continuing the conversation.