Topic: Excessive noise or not?

I manage a large multifamily apartment complex with apartments on 3 floors. A resident on the 3rd floor has made a complaint about the resident on the second floor making noise that disturbs her. The noise is made generally in the evening between 6pm-9pm or on the weekends during the day when the 2nd floor tenant is home. The noise as reported by the 3rd floor tenant is heaving walking, slamming cabinet doors in the bathroom, or slamming cabinets in the kitchen, or hearing the tenant walk outside on the patio to smoke, slamming doors in the apartment etc. The 3rd floor tenant has been keeping track of this noise for a month and is now upset about what she calls constant noise. I have talked to the 2nd floor tenant and she explained that she is not doing it on purpose she is just living in her apartment. She doesn't believe the noise is unreasonable. At what point is a complaint of noise during regular hours (our quiet time is 10pm-8am)to be considered an enforceable violation? At what point do I tell the 3rd floor neighbor it's regular apartment living, deal with it.

Have you asked the 3rd floor tenant of a recording of the noise? After listening to the recording ask yourself is this regular apartment noise or is the tenant being too loud? Then send your violations or talk to the tenant explaining this is regular noise and at this time a violation will not be sent out, however please keep us informed if the noises are happening during quiet hours.

First off, it would be great if people understood instinctively what "apartment living noises" sound like, hahaha! How long has this person been a resident (the one in the 3rd floor unit)? It feels to me like she hasn't a clue about shared living spaces.

Once a resident, right or wrong, complains, you address the issue in writing to both residents as neutrally as possible and then that is it. If the upstairs person complains again (and she will) our policy is kind of Tough Toenails. Our standard policy outside of Quiet Hours is you may just have to live with it until you move, especially for people who want to go to bed at 8:oopm and the neighbor gets home from work at 6:00pm, vacuums at 7:30pm and runs a load of laundry at 9:00pm. Is this reasonable? Yes, to everyone except the person who habitually retires at 8:00pm.

I would explain to both residents in my written and mailed response (or emailed) that concessions in personal habits need respect. Sometimes, the person who is being accused of making excessive noise will become annoyed of accusations, so you really have a small window to work out an amicable solution.

We have a quite a few large buildings and lately this topic has been raised way too many times. The 1st floor tenant is mad because the upper tenant is stomping (she's not, she's a heavier lady) and I finally said, you live in a building and i expect you to hear noise. This person is not stomping with malicious intent to wake you up. I cannot tell tenants when they can walk to the bathroom, nor can I tell them what shift to work or that they can't make themselves food when they get off their second shift job. I have heard it all. Another tenant works third shift and expects silence during the daytime hours above her. I just have got into the habit of redirecting them to speak with their neighbors and have a discussion and see if they can work it out. When I do that I usually get an emphatic NO. I'm a fair, logical person, who also happens to live on the first floor of one of our other buildings, so trust me, I hear things and there isn't anything they can 'complain' about that I don't already hear on a somewhat daily basis. It's the price you pay for having shared spaces and living in an apartment. Unless someone is throwing a rager at 1am and loud music or fighting is coming from a unit, I don't want to hear it. So stressful. :)

We have our on-site super verify noise complaints when the complaints are repetitive so we can better evaluate the situation. Once we have the super listen to the noise we are better able to address the situation as we have a better understanding if the noise is excessive or if we have a resident who doesn't understand that apartment living means sometimes you are going to hear your neighbors.

If the noise is excessive then we have another meeting with the "problem resident" and explain that the noise was verified as excessive and controllable and we then take the opportunity to remind the resident that they are living in an apartment in need to be considerate of their neighbors and remind them of their lease obligation to not interfere with their neighbor's right to quiet enjoyment of his/her home.

If the super determines that the noise is normal apartment living sometimes we will offer to relocate the resident to the top floor with the understanding that you are going to hear your neighbors from time to time; you may hear the closet doors close, you may hear the garbage disposal, etc as it is apartment living but we want you happy and we want to retain you as a happy resident.

Hi Molly,

I completely understand where you are coming from and where both residents are coming from as well. I myself have been in both residents shoes and was frustrated that I never had resolve from common disturbances between my neighbors.

I get phone calls like this what seems weekly and it's usually the same two tenants (different buildings). I too, live in a lower unit in our of our properties and have heard my neighbors 4 year old on occasion, but she and I have a great relationship and if i feel it's a little too much jumping or running I will text her. Not everyone is like that. I usually encourage my tenants to speak with their neighbors first before calling the office, unless it's something like a WWE tag team fight or loud music after midnight. This is what I tell tenants 'you live in a shared space and I would expect you to hear noise. Some people have heavy steps, some people work late shifts and yes, some people come home from their second shift job and want to make a late dinner.' If I thought someone was 'stomping' with malicious intent to make the lower tenant miserable I would address it, however I would expect a 16 year old girl to walk back and forth the bathroom or the kitchen. People don't fly. I will make a note and if i feel the concern is valid I will address it with both tenants, but lately it has just been getting more frequent with the same tenant. If we had a second floor vacant unit 'd offer her that one!

Let a "Maintenance Guy" throw a possible wrench in the works. (A slightly different viewpoint).

Has there been an evaluation made for construction or repairs? Many older buildings were built with a sub floor system in mind that included carpet pad and carpet. This means that when we update to hard surfaces, noises are carried floor to floor easier, possibly creating more noise. (I'm not making an excuse or a reason for all situations just a possible cause.)

Another thing that can be checked in regards to cabinet doors, which seem to be an issue, are slamming closed. What about installing felt pads to the cabinets to decrease noise of closing? If pads are in place, and the downstairs resident still complains of slamming, then perhaps the upstairs neighbor needs a class in cabinet closing etiquette to prevent damage to the property.

It reminds me of an upstairs resident that we changed the toilet seat to one that has a "can't-slam" hinge as a condition of the downstairs renewal.

Excellent points. We do have one particularly older building where the sub floors/carpet etc allow for noises to carry much more than in our other buildings. I do remind people of that. Good points on the slamming and such, I am definitely going to put that in my arsenal of ideas!

I have to say, this is such an issue, one that I never experienced until later in life, being a long-time renter below others most times. Having been in one unit for years, there have been many tenants in the unit above me during that time, a few that have been excessively disruptive, when other tenants have barely been heard in the same unit, so it comes down to the individual.

I have experienced a couple of them who would race around for hours each day as if nothing was "ever finished", those doing so from the afternoon until late evening. Now, I understand one doing housework, but there is usually a stopping point. Regular housework is not the problem, unless after hours. I feel that for one to perform tasks excessively hard comes from something within them being a personality issue, possibly being affected by caffeine or are hyperactive. You wonder, how this type was raised to become so thoughtless and disrespectful.

As mentioned, it is hearing the endless SLAMMING, THUDS or STOMPING on a ceiling that can drive another nuts, in addition to stereo BASS noise, Loud TV volume, a rumbling, amplified sound from a Subwoofer. Again, this is not just daily living sounds when one may drop something occasionally or make accidental sounds. Amazingly there is no category to include this annoyance, having the categories of "Everyday Living" OR "Nuisance Noise". ???? ("Welp, can't help ya there...that's just daily living" or "nothing can be done about how one walks"). Yeah, okay.. maybe leave your mansion and come spend a night here and see how long you can stand it. ????

My current neighbor is one of the biggest offenders, arriving home late and playing loud Audio sounds after midnight, always rapidly stomping so hard and his specialty of slamming windows at any hour, recently having a visitor who is speed-stomping even harder, back and forth, back and forth.. again, it's the speed and the aggression that others do not want to feel in their own relaxed unit.

The difficult thing is, having this resolved by those who could or should do something, yet is disregarded. Having a nice, but passive manager who does not understand how to address, led by another who could not be bothered. I think a tenant who has been asked to change behavior but continues, is a problem. When the offender is a phony and liar, nothing is resolved. It can be thought that the victim is only overreacting, when again, NO ONE knows what the tenant is experiencing and should be witnessed, with consequences for the thoughtless noisemaker. (And what is the point of one signing an agreement, when they are not following rules?) ????
This is an ongoing issue from what I have read that many experience and should not, while paying to live comfortably and considerately in their own space. There should be rules, laws to control the widespread incidence of unnecessary, excessive racket being foisted upon the more appropriate, respectful renter.

We live in a crazy world right now .. where up is down, and down is up.

I live by one simple rule : If everyone gives, then everyone has.
The giving is the sacrifice you make for living in close quarters (not making loud noises), and maybe that is incentive for saving for a house some day (if possible).
If everyone does this, then all receive the benefit, which is having peace of mind and feeling like they live in a real home. Where else can a person gather their senses and make clear decisions about life than their home. Without finding this anywhere, a person could feel cornered and go crazy.

Loud people are just plain and simple inconsiderate. They don't have that basic human trait to care about other people in the world. They should have been taught that by their parents at a very early age.

I totally agree because I'm going thru that right now what ever they say to her last for about a week and back to the nonsense again

The “sacrifice” I make for living is close quarters is paying about twice what a mortgage would cost to a landlord who doesn’t want to enforce their own rules. I can’t believe the attitudes of the landlords on here: “that’s what you get for living in an apartment”. Wait, actually I can totally believe that. Landlord reputations are verifiably earned with this kind of talk.
And most renters would love to save for a house but that’s hardly possible when the rent keeps going up (despite no changes or upgrades to the apartment). And then to say we deserve what we get for not having a home of our own? Shame on you!

For the most part it's not the tenants, it's greedy landlords and cheaply constructed buildings. It's all about money (as usual).

I’m living this right now! I’ve mostly rented single family homes or homes converted into multi family. I moved into a complex a few months ago and can hear everything coming from upstairs and the banshee living next door. The units are all hardwood floors that creak like an old house. Normal walking sounds like they’re stomping and stomping sound like the ceiling will cave in. My pictures shake when they slam doors. I’m trying to tough it out and wear earplugs to bed. I’m definitely not renewing my lease.

Wish you were my landlord. When i moved into my current apartment my landlord told me exactly that. Told me i couldn't have activity at night because it bothered the people below me. I explained im not doing anything but sitting in a chair watching tv, with headphones and using the bathroom, she continued to harass me for months. All while they slam their door so hard it literally shakes my apartment, and play their music so loud i can't even hear my tv through headphones!

That would be great, and better carpet paddind would drinker help where i live but my landlords are insanely cheap and some of the stuff hasn't been updated in at least 30 or 40 years

What about at 11pm? I have a neighbor that has wood floors. Their 'entertainment room' is directly above my bedroom, so I'm frequently hearing them moving around upstairs. They also have a dog. They they frequently make noise in that room AFTER 10 pm...as in almost every night. It's 10:36 here, and I'm hearing them in that room right now. I don't care about the noise they make during the day...it's the noise they make at night that upsets me, because it wakes me up when I'm trying to sleep. And thanks to my incredible hearing, it's even worse for me. My hearing is so good that it is similar to having hyperacusis. So even though I sleep like the dead, that noise is enough to both wake me up and prevent me from falling to sleep. Is it legal if she's making normal amounts of noise in the middle of the night? Because I think I'm going to have to make a formal complaint with the police due to the fact that my landlord is refusing to intervene. her take is that she's within her rights due to the face that it's just her walking around, mine is that walking around at 11pm, 12 am, 1 am, and even 2 am isn't normal OR acceptable.

Yes. Normal amounts of noise in the middle of the night are perfectly legal and for some, normal. I work 3rd shift full-time so two nights a week I'm at my apartment above people, awake, and walking around. It's just how I operate due to my working hours. I don't make excess noise, I don't play my TV super loud, or blast music etc... (in otherwords, I try to remain empathetic and understanding that others are trying to exist/sleep around me) but I am up and walking around at 11pm, 12a, 1a, all the way to around 5 or 6am. My TV is on, I do talk on the phone or to my roomates sometimes. That's my life. It's no different than when I go to sleep, during the day from around 6a-ish to around 3p-ish. Other people talk, or walk around, do chores, or watch TV, play music or whatever they do, (typically much louder too because that's more acceptable), but I just have to accept that people have a different schedule than I do. Some people get home from work at 11pm at night, and prefer to be awake at night AFTER they get off, just like you do. That's extremely normal.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't maybe try to reach out to see if a compromise could be made, or that you shouldn't call the police/property manager if there is actually loud or excessive noise after quiet hours. What I am saying is that maybe you should have some empathy and understanding for someone who might operate a bit different than you do. Sometimes in life, people operate different to how we do, and we have to just suck it up and learn to live with it.

Yes. Normal amounts of noise in the middle of the night are perfectly legal and for some, normal. I work 3rd shift full-time so two nights a week I'm at my apartment above people, awake, and walking around. It's just how I operate due to my working hours. I don't make excess noise, I don't play my TV super loud, or blast music etc... (in otherwords, I try to remain empathetic and understanding that others are trying to exist/sleep around me) but I am up and walking around at 11pm, 12a, 1a, all the way to around 5 or 6am. My TV is on, I do talk on the phone or to my roomates sometimes. That's my life. It's no different than when I go to sleep, during the day from around 6a-ish to around 3p-ish. Other people talk, or walk around, do chores, or watch TV, play music or whatever they do, (typically much louder too because that's more acceptable), but I just have to accept that people have a different schedule than I do. Some people get home from work at 11pm at night, and prefer to be awake at night AFTER they get off, just like you do. That's extremely normal.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't maybe try to reach out to see if a compromise could be made, or that you shouldn't call the police/property manager if there is actually loud or excessive noise after quiet hours. What I am saying is that maybe you should have some empathy and understanding for someone who might operate a bit different than you do. Sometimes in life, people operate different to how we do, and we have to just suck it up and learn to live with it.

The thing is, if being after hours, one needs to understand there do exist "Quiet Hours" from 10 pm to 7-8 am. Another tenant should not have to hear a music Bass beat, TV dialogue or amplified rumbling, thundering sounds upon their ceiling or from an adjoining wall. In addition, those stomping, racing back and forth, forcefully slamming after hours, etc., are not caring to be conscious of others whom most likely are on a nighttime sleep schedule.

It should not just loosely be deemed "apartment living", building construction or having one feel entitled since they too pay rent, but should be considered how impact sounds will travel thru walls and ceilings. Frankly, what is described should not have to be invasively heard at ANY hour, which can feel like an act of aggression invading one's space.

Having experienced many neighbors over a stretch of several years, most of whom I did not hear excessive noise from or any sounds at all, having apparently been conscious and respectful. It has only been a few later on -- and appearing to be same personality.... they want what they want, are self-involved, possibly narcissistic and can be retaliatory if even nicely asking for their assistance in this matter. I feel badly for those having to endure such a personality, when there exist others whom are not at all like that.

There is noise ordinance between 8am to 10pm.
If noise is greater than 55 Decibels during day it is noise violation in Bellevue Washington.
You don’t have to tolerate it.
If management is not help, take the tenants to Court.