Topic: Fair Housing experts out there, who should pay for the floors in this situation?

I know there are Fair housing experts on this site, and I have a question. I'm in Texas. I have a resident who lives upstairs. She has asthma and wants her carpet removed and wood floors installed as a reasonable modification. In your expert opinion, who should pay for the floors? Her or us? Our primary issue is the noise problem for the downstairs neighbor. This resident also has two ESA long haired dogs. We have offered to transfer her to a downstairs, replace the padding (for the 2nd time) and shampoo. She has refused all. Its floors or nothing.

I would allow if she pays for flooring or offer to release from lease.

but then downstairs will complain. It's encroaching on other's full use and enjoyment of their home. I don't think I'd do it.

HUD ruled it was a reasonable accommodation and we had to pay for the floor.

She should pay for it

My point is I think the right place is happy medium. She can have her floors, but putting vinyl flooring on the 2nd floor encroaches on the full use and enjoyment of the neighbor's home. This is tricky, but I think she's gotta go to the first floor. Maybe go ahead and pay for the floor as a negotiating factor?

The cost to replace depends if you have Federal funds on your property . You also need for a Doctor to verify there is a nexus between her disability and her request . If you do not have Federal funds on the property she is on the hook for the replacement . Also it depends on if it causes a financial burden on the property. Do you have Federal funding and a healthy reserve or operating account? If so and the Dr verifies the need you’re on the hook

I’m not sure that would be a reasonable accommodation. Carpet is usually upstairs on all units to help eliminate the sound to the below units. I honestly would request she fill out the forms and submit to your attorney to see if it is reasonable.

If it is a reasonable accommodation the resident does NOT pay for it.

They do make sound proof padding for flooring. I would recommend a luxury vinyl that is water proof and is extremely durable. Way cheaper than real wood.

Last I checked we are not responsible for changing the flooring in a unit that she rented that way. You can do it as an accommodation but her cost.

Valerie Vincent if you're conventional, yes. If you're affordable, this is NOT true.

Landlord pays if there is even 1 penny of federal funds. This doesn’t change the use or value. I would def see if your attorney knows of a way for a compromise due to the rights of the lower level residents for quiet enjoyment. It may not be considered reasonable and a compromise might be a 1st floor transfer with floors installed, mutual lease rescission, or an acknowledgment drafted that she understands the increase in noise could result in lease violations or eviction.

You don't have to install hardwood. Vinyl/laminate will work.

It has to be REASONABLE. You could argue it would be unreasonable to expect the downstairs neighbor to endure more noise. I’d tell her she can move to a downstairs unit and have vinyl plank flooring that LOOKS like wood, but that’s the only option. She doesn’t like it, she can move.

If ur property is subsidize by section 504 u have to pay, unless it's a financial burden for the property,,,

How does she have asthma that requires a reasonable accommodation for removal of carpet, but has two long hair dogs?

Amy Sexton Horsley that's exactly right! They are huskies!

When you call to verify the reasonable accommodation with the doctor and ask for suggestions on flooring I would bring up that point.

Not reasonable as it will keep the downstairs occupant(s) from enjoying their home. Carpet and pad is required on all second floor units for noise control. Release from her contract so she can find what she needs. If you have a risk mgmt dept they handle the request and the response for all accommodation requests. If not, your company’s attorney.

I’m not sure id consider that reasonable at all
But if done, she pays

Side note: if she pays to have the new flooring installed and then later moves out, she may also have to pay to restore the flooring to its original condition, if it would hamper the next person from taking occupancy.

At the renters cost.

I've been in the flooring industry for 25 years and I've seen this many times. I've had managers in the past ask the resident to see their vacuum and if they're vacuum it's full of stuff and is a non HEPA filtration vacuum then you can blame it on that. People with pets claiming they have asthma ridiculous most of the time their apartments are very dirty and that's the real cause of any respiratory issue.

They just want new flooring most of the time

I had this issue at a property I managed and we attempted to fight it and she filed a fair housing claim; she won

In the long run you will come out the winner with replacement

the insurance industry and building code states floor is a non issue. a concrete floor makes a unit still habitable. perhaps sheet vinyl flooring with a low glue VOC rating? in any event, what ever you do, a third party from her doctor signing off that all proposed material, cleaning , prep materials, adhesives etc will not interact with the type asthma she has or could be tearing it all out again

Are you a funded property? If so, you pay. What does her provider say? Will the other options be a solution?

Hmmm, I think we first have to know if Asthma qualifies as a handicap. I'm not sure it does. I thought it was an illness. If not, then I dont think you have to make any reasonable accommodations, do you? I guess you could, but then you may be forced to oblige everyone with Asthma. I think any money you spend on an attorney is money well spent. I'd consider going one step further and ask him/her to write the response.
I'd love to know what the outcome is

First ask her to put her request in writing. Then refer it to your attorney. You may need to release her from her lease

That’s not a reasonable accommodation, it’s a modification request. Interior modifications are paid by the resident.

First piece of advice, always consult with an attorney to ensure you're covering all bases.
This modification sounds reasonable. With no specific federal funding requirements on the community the resident is responsible for cost to replace the flooring AND if deemed hardwood flooring will later impair your ability to rent the apartment to another resident you can also require resident to put money aside to reinstall carpet when she moves out. Because of potential sound issue you may be able to require specific flooring product that comes with some sound-absorbing underlayment. However, not certain the "possibility" of disturbing neighbors would justify denying a request or requiring additional costs to the resident.
Again, still recommend consulting an attorney.

One of my customers just had that issue with a tenant. It was considered a reasonable accommodation and the apartment paid for the floors. We installed vinyl plank with sound barrier padding since she was on the 3rd floor. The downstairs residents will never even realize there isn't carpet and pad above them.

The tenant has to pay for the modifications. And if there’s an issue with respect to sound then before you put down the wood floor have an architect design sound deadening or minimizing subflooring. The tenant would have to pay for all the changes. And wood floor is not necessarily required you can offer a suggestion that she uses a laminate. Regardless the tenant has to pay the cost Of the modifications as part of your accommodation.

Jennifer Rysdam - your approach is a lawsuit waiting to happen. You might want to take a fair housing class that focuses on ada , reasonable accommodation and when a landlord should cover the cost and when a resident pays for accommodating a resident’s request

Let me get this straight - she lives UPstairs and have two dogs that require her to routinely go up/down stairs for them to potty? Sounds pretty bogus to me, and she is using "reasonable modification" to get her way with wood flooring. The apartment wasn't that way when she signed up for it, so I would require her to pay for it. It sounds to me that she knows how to play the fair housing system.

guys, if the property is gov't subsidized the housing provider must pay for modifications. If the person has a disability, we must accommodate. You are swimming in muddy water. I would speak with your company attorney and be very clear before you make a decision. If you accepted her ESA dogs, you must have determined that she has a disability. Also, I question that the floors have to be wood. There are types of vinyl that would help her with asthma issue and look as good, and likely less noisy for those below. Let us know how this comes out, please.

I would let her do an on-site transfer to a first floor location that already has different flooring other than carpet

A reasonable modification is at her expense, but stress your noise complaint policy. 3 complaints, non renewal. She may decide 1st floor is best. Again, any modification is at her expense which means if she ever moves, it could be at her expense to xhange it back if your property is pre 1988 construction.

First question. Is this low income or conventional? If low income company pays. But you could offer to transfer to 1st floor apartment with wood floors. If she refuses you have tried to make a reasonable accommodation, and she refused. End of story.
If conventional, resident pays for cost AND cost to make the building whole again after they move out. Meaning they need to put into escrow the cost to remove the hardwood and replace with carpet.
I’ve been in both situations as a regional in Cleveland.

There is a total difference between reasonable accommodation and a reasonable modification. I am not a lawyer, so my advice is to have this resident complete out a reasonable modification form and have a lawyer review it. Most likely they will say this is a modification and that the resident is responsible but it is better in these cases to error on the side of caution.

It’s not a reasonable accommodations. You have offered a solution. But she refused. This would cause a financial burden on the property. The cost should be on the resident and you would have the right to use your vendor and require a sound barrier. My opinion of course.

It depends on the type of property, you should still contact your attorney. I recall from prior trainings, and with my experience, if it’s a HUD Subsidized unit, you can offer to replace for a basic vinyl of pergo, if they wish to have hardwood floors then they can pay the difference. If you are not subsidized then you can approve the flooring at their cost. If your rules mandate there should not be a specific type of modification or flooring due to noise, you can offer a transfer to a downstairs unit and offer reasonable accommodations based on your type of property. I am in California so laws may be slightly different which is why I suggest you speak to an attorney. Fair Housing lawsuits can be very costly and often times you are better off obtaining legal assistance. They can also help you mitigate the grievance with your resident.

Wait you’ve already replaced her carpet and padding before? Her dogs are the issue.

Offer to for the transfer to be at no cost to her. What happens if and when she moves out and you get new tenants in there? Request or reasonable accommodation can be approved by putting her in a first floor home.

If cost is an issue you could put in a wood plank LVT. Looks real nice very durable.

If she is handicap or disable and has requested reasonable accommodation it is at the cost of the property...
Rule you give reasonable accommodations if it does not put an undue burden on the property..4350.3 REV
pages 2-37 thru 2-41.The cost of replacing the flooring should not cause an undue burden....you can use VCT tile, laminate tile, laminate flooring, float flooring this has a layer of cushion under the flooring..our flooring had the appearance of wood. hopes this helps

Who's to say that you change out the floors and there's not something else in the apartment that affects her asthma? I've had residents ask the same thing and when I go to their unit there's dust on the ceiling fans, air vents, buildup around window sills, etc. There's no guarantee that this will solve their issue. She should transfer to a first floor unit.

To Whom It May Concern:

In my opinion I would not even consider replacing the carpet with hardwood flooring on a 2nd floor. Your correct and have an obligation to those whom live below her to control the noise.

I you have a vacant apartment on 1st floor where there is worn carpet you were planning on replacing anyways, then I would contemplate it, but if there is a price difference tenant transferring should absorb that cost.

This I would only do once her lease is ready for renewal and only then if terms are agreeded to and this in your opinion is a good long standing resident. Otherwise she would have options to move elsewhere.

-Dan-

Daniel Flipse- Property Supervisor
602 Partners, LLC

A reasonable "accommodation" is a change to a rule, policy or procedure (such as allowing ESA/service animals on a non-pet site). A reasonable "modification" is a physical alteration. Accommodations are always paid by the site regardless of financing. Modifications are paid by the site on federally-financed sites, and paid by resident on conventionally-financed sites. See attaached

Agreed . . . . but flooring is a reasonable MODIFICATION. If site is conventionally-financed, resident pays (if it is determined to be "reasonable"

They have cork backing on the plank flooring now that works very well in reducing the noise factor.

It is a violation of the Fair Housing Act for any person to refuse to make a reasonable accommodation in rules, policies, practices, or services, when such accommodations may be necessary to afford a handicapped person equal opportunity to use and enjoy a dwelling unit, including public and common use areas.

Individuals who are disabled may request a reasonable accommodation in housing. A person is considered disabled if they have a physical or mental impairment which substantially limits one or more of their major life activities, if they have a record of having such an impairment, or if they are regarded as having such an impairment.

Severe asthma counts as a disability. It's covered by The Equality Act 2010, which protects people from being discriminated against.

I would replace the flooring and not charge them. Not worth possible legal expenses.

Karen has given you the best advice. Also your verification form should ask the doctor if he/she is willing to testify in court that there is a nexus between the resident's disability and the accommodation of a "wooden floor" and not any other type flooring. HUD prohibits asking what the nature of the disability is, but not verifying that there is a nexus between the accommodation and the disability.

If you replace the floors she should pay for them. As well if you replace the floors there will be a noise issue for the downstairs neighbor. Either way there will be costs incurred even if you move her to the first floor and she still wants the carpet removed. If it were me I would work with her in releasing her from her lease but not without some financial give and take.