Topic: Not privy to contracts, budgets, etc.

So I earlier this month I took on a C property because I love to tame the chaos. I have my issues that are pretty standard when taking over a property that has been neglected such as nonstop resident complaints, pages and pages of work orders, horribly dirty grounds, lazy and unmotivated staff memebers, and scumbag residents. These things i can handle and have no real problems with.

However, my problem is directly with the owner and corporate office. How can Ii have an overbearing, yet non-responsive corporate office? A micromanaging, yet non-involved owner/boss? A know it all, yet clueless asst??

When I started i was thrown into the fire and had an MAJOR argument with the assistant due to her attitude..she was frustrated bc she was doing her job and my job! Per the corporate office/owner she is not well liked by residents ane has been counseled a number of times regarding her professionalism and customer service.

I knew of vandalism and loitering and was advised about finding courtesy officers immediately. Secured 2 definite applications within the week, as one SAPD office lives onesite already. I lost 1 CO due to corporate not processing app until this Monday and officer needing to relocate from Floresville ASAP as lease was ending. Now my owner is griping about me getting the position filled when I sent the apps almost a month ago!

My owner had a talk with me about my bonus structure which entails a tier each for budgeting, customer service, and occupancy. He tells me if I meet budget and /or reduce costs I can get up to $15k annually. Yay! Right? Wrong, i don't see the budget so how do I know what I'm doing? Am I cutting costs, getting a return on my marketing costs, overspending on supplies, saving out the wazoo or what? I asked for a pressure washer machine and was told its not in the budget! Ha! So I don't have $250?

I cannot get a carpet cleaned or replaced, paint a wall, order a fridge, plant a flower, or fix a burst underground pipe without his approval. We have a contract for the carpet cleaners, painters, housekeepers, etc with set prices (which I've never seen bc I'm not allowed to see the contracts), but I have to get a bid for the owner, do a PO, and wait for PO approval before I can do anything. Mind you they only approve on T/Th and sometimes not all the POs. Even when the stuff is approved it still takes days to get stuff scheduled with vendors.

I cannot make a flyer, write a letter to residents, design the community newsletter, move an icon on my desktop, or delete an email per company policy. Did I mention I'm salaried, but I have a time sheet even though my owner can clearly see me logged in messenger bc it's also not allowed to be signed in or away, if you're not working??

I want to stay bc it's so close to home, but I think I'm putting in my 2 weeks tomorrow! The owner won't budge on any of the policies and I've gotten in trouble a number of times for not clocking in and out properly, sending out a pest control notice to an infested building, using eggshell instead of Sudan paint, and getting an apt turned bc I was going to lose the lease.

It sounds a lot like my last position... I was hired by one PMC, and not given any support I needed. I had well over $100k in unpaid bills, I could not get anything done; yet I stuck with it. It was so bad that I thought very seriously about calling the owner and wanting to meet with someone on his team 'off the record' to discuss the problems I inherited; which, aside from the unpaid bills that limited my ability to order stuff I needed; also included:

-Vacancy, of 66 units, 17 were vacant.
-Delinquency, I had over $13000 in unpaid rent and needed to initiate eviction on some residents for unpaid rent among other reasons.
-The property was recovering from a property wide bedbug infestation that cost over $50k to resolve. I had completed this early on.
-My direct supervisor was based out of the corporate office in another part of the state and I would only see her about every 10 days or so. She was not available to me when I needed help.
-I also had over $100k in unpaid bills and many vendors would not talk to me about anything but the past due bills. I even had the company that was monitoring the fire systems terminate the contract with no recourse, even after explaining that the owner terminated the PMC and a new PMC was assuming management that week. Needless to say; I could not get anything done and had to pick the units with the least amount of problems to turn first. I also had service to one of my phone lines interrupted when a bill fell through the cracks unpaid. The first major thing I did after the transfer is fire AT&T and move all communications to Comcast (all phone lines, community TV, and office internet on the same bill AND I was able to give residents FREE WiFi for the entire property).

I debated about sitting down with the owner until I get a call from my boss 6 months after I was hired telling me that the owner fired them and is in the process of hiring a new company. I was fortunate in that I knew the new company and was able to stay on board after the transfer. My new boss was very receptive to hearing what I was dealing with and how I thought it needed to be handled.

When I left the property, I had 3 vacant units despite a needed spike in vacancy; less than $1000 in delinquencies, the bedbug infestation taken care of, and a boss that was 10 minutes away most of the time, and when he wasn't within 10 minutes, I was able to call for help.

It sounds like you need to have a calm meeting with your owner and ask for the tools and authority you need to be effective in meeting his objectives. Tell him what you are experiencing and present him a solution with projected timelines and expected results.

If the owner will not provide this information so you can meet his needs, then you need to consider if this challenge is right for you. Make sure you document everything you have done, everything you want to do, and everything you have presented; but were denied.

You need to also get rid of that assistant; she is causing you trouble. I am sure she has also cost residents as well.

Wow this post sure makes me feel good. I am, of course, sympathetic for the OP and I am a little shocked at Johnny's previous situation he describes.
All I can say is that there wouldn't be "none of me" working for someone like that.

If you going to be a manager of a property or even a lemonade stand, you have to in fact BE the manager. Corporate oversight is necessary, and even comfortable, but micromanagement is a non starter. If you cannot have a budget how are you going to follow one. I guess I am highly spoiled. In the ten years I have been involved in property management, it has nearly all been my call on what I did or did not do with six to eight properties. The PMC never got involved unless I called them in. I considered that they existed for taking the heavy hits, and I existed for running the show. I always had 110% full and unbridled support in every property and every action I undertook for them. Usually it was just a matter of "Here's the keys, and we sure hope you have a nice day, and let us know if you need us". (They sincerely hoped I would not need them).

I am always amazed at people who find themselves working in a "me against them" mentality. The mentality is usually generated by the employer, but can be misapplied by the employee. It is best never, ever to work "for" someone. You always want to work "with" someone or ones.

No, I would have to be the manager if I were going to be the manager. Yes, give me your options, directions, goals and desires. Then I will meet them. I would have to tell them they hired me to do it, now go home and let me get back to work!

The problem with Herb's response is how can the OP reasonably expect to do the job she was hired for without the tools and support to do what is needed to meet the goals?

Not only that, she inherited a team member who's attitude indicates that she is not playing for the same team.

It sounds like there is a trust issue on the part of the owner in this case; which makes them feel the need to be hands on. If she can foster a relationship where the owner can give up some of that trust and some of the need to be hands on; she would be better off. She needs the support of the owner and the tools to do the job if she is going to be able to meet the expectations.


The only way she will be successful is if she were to be able to create a strong interdependent relationship with the owners: The owners are going to DEPEND on her to manage the property the best way she can with the resources she needs; and she is going to DEPEND on the owners for the tools and support do do so in the most effective manner possible. This is not DEPENDENCE, nor INDEPENDENCE; rather it is INTERDEPENDENCE where each party depends on one another to hold up their end of the deal.

Having this discussion with the owner sooner rather than later is going to be critical in terms of her success. If nothing changes after this discussion, then she should feel free to move on. In the meantime; I suggest that she prepare her resume and start distributing it to see if she can line up something to go to.

In my case; I later learned that the transfer in management was in process before I stepped in the door; which made me feel very fortunate to have survived long enough to solve the problems I inherited without blaming my predecessors.

I have had the conversation with my owner about allowing me to take on the responsbility to alleviate his stress. I in fact told him I welcome it! This is why I want to leave because he doesnt seem to get it - that he's giving me a very nice salary only to wait for answers all day. I cannnot within myself just sit by and get a paycheck. Since I know he has trust issues, I recommended slow and gradual responsiblilties. I laid out a plan and what it took to achieve it...nothing. I feels like I am wrong for wanting to do my job.

All I want to do is afford him a great manager with some pretty great talent because from what I have seen everyone else is just a puppet and goes through the motions. No one thinks to ask to change anything because "it's always been that way." My assistant needs to be shown the door, but guess what? I dont have the authority to see her on her way. To me it means I have no control or say say in what goes on under my roof and the roof is coming down!

Hey Herb. I am calling on every deity known to man to help me. I know I can turn this place into something great if the owner would go on vacation or something. I want to send him a yacht brochure and a captains hat.

You are right on in your post, I need to BE the manager, not some well dressed liaison or personal assistant. You are not spoiled (you might be), but I've never worked anywhere like this. Like you, I've been handed keys while the owners and/or regional hurried off to the airport. I hardly ever talked to corporate, at least not about getting permission to change a carpet and I sure as hell never had daily conversations with my owner about balloons and pillows for the models. What?! Like you said I want to work with him, but he's not having it. I guess it's back hunting I go. I am fortunate to be in a situation where I don't have to stay, so when it comes down to it the loss will be on him.

Also, you're right about my asst. she is a real piece of work. It's not her job to put out balloons, not her job to do grounds, not her job to check time sheets, not her job ro lease, she's the "bookkeeper" she "keeps books." if I could I'd send her on a nice vacation. We had a property clean up day where everyone dressed down, pressure washed, changed light bulbs, turned over the gardens, laid locks, had ice cream..just a real good laid back day. Where was she? In the office moping. I have had conversations with the owner about her, he brought it to my attn after our altercation. I dont have a personal issue with her. She is used to being the "presence" in the office and now I'm there and the only "presence" I like in the office is work. I am almost 10 years younger than her, so we butt heads on a lot of topics. I also remember to try and use her experience and input in the decisions I can make, but since "I'm the boss, I don't need her [sic]."

I'm not looking to blame anyone or understand why things are bad at our property, I'm there to fix it. I can't do the job I was hired to do because he won't let me and I face opposition from her as well, which at times can rile up the other team members.

If you feel that way and you are in a position to 'not need' the work, then I support your decision to leave.

Start your job search as confidentially as possible and schedule interviews carefully; make sure prospective employers know you are employed and why you are looking for a change. They will understand when you need to schedule interviews for lunch meetings, after hours, or weekends if possible.

When you have an offer, write up a 2 week notice and hand it to him the next time he is on property. Then the ball is in his court.

You have a bad combination: problem property, an entrenched team with attitude problems, and an owner that feels the need to be too involved in the daily operations probably due to your predecessor.

If you decide to stay without being given the tools you need, are you processing invoices at your level for payment?

I was in a similar situation several years ago. It was a tax credit property in a high-crime area. I drove 30 minutes to get there because I wanted to "make a difference." I stayed 5 months.

On my last day, I was sitting in the dark with no electricty, no internet, no heat, the water was being turned off that day and the residents didn't have lighting in the breezeways and common area. They threatened to call the local news company.

I had vendors calling everyday threatening to take me to small claims court to collect their unpaid invoices. My occupancy dropped to 78% from 95% because of the gun fire every night.

I couldn't advertise because they wouldn't pay a $200 bill to the newspaper. I was located down a back street, way off the main road surrounded by crack houses.

I could go on and on. I was told I needed to "take control of my property" by my regional manager and I just wanted to laugh in her face.

I managed to make enough difference that I had a repuation for being tough that followed me back to my current property 1 year later by a customer who lived in that town.

Run, run, run! Be prepared to explain in your next interview why you couldn't handle the job. But, get out before they fire you. That would look even worse on your resume.

Go with the obvious, this property is not for you. You don't have to convince yourself it's the right thing for you to do. Your a superstar, go where you can shine and not have to hide behind the moon!

I have some suggestions, but you may not like them. Hahaha. First of all, let me tell you a little about micromanagers. They are not born this way; they have learned to become this way, usually because they've been burned once, twice thrice; they have been used by people, stolen from by onsite teams. They have had their own bosses who behaved this way. I'll let you in on a little secret - sometimes, not always, you can learn a lot from these people. Micromanagers are a bit OCD!

In order for them to relax and begin to develop trust, you have to prove to them that your thinking mirrors theirs. If you want to keep this position, you have to do it his way whether or not you like it. I would sit down in my office and begin listing all areas you need help with: Budget; Personnel; Curb Appeal; Turn Schedule; Marketing & Vendors. Then come up with a plan to address each area. Then start thinking of ways to get the information you need.

Example 1: Budget - I have worked for 8 months or more onsite with no Budget in hand. Didn't stop me from making the property successful at all. If you have some prior experience, create your own budget template and go with what has worked in the past for other properties.
Example 2: Contracts - Call each vendor and ask them to send you copies of theirs.
Example 3: Vendors - For each Vendor, write them a letter on your company letterhead explaining you are a new Manager there and need to know about any outstanding issues and you are there to help develop a better relationship and keep them paid on time. They are going to be thrilled you took the bull by the horns.
Example 4: Personnel - Begin to recruit someone new as your Assistant (someone who will do more than "keep the books." What is that? Isn't that the Corporate Accountant's job???
Example 5: Marketing - Put together your Marketing Plan (in writing, in Powerpoint)
Example 6: Curb Appeal - Assign a tech whose job is picking up the Grounds each morning or insist that the Mainteance Team do it together first thing each morning. Solicit ideas from Garden Centers on new plantings and cost to install.
Example 7: Turn Schedule - List all vacants and what needs to be done to each to get it market ready. Put this into an Excel spreadsheet if necessary.

THEN: Email and Call your owner 25 times a day letting him know you need approval of your Budget and your Marketing Plan and your Turn Schedule. Tell him exactly how you are going to Outreach market in detail. Document every instance of problems with onsite team members and how you handled it. Write them up anyway for insubordination. Submit these Write Ups by email attachment to the Owner. Let him know you want and want you need. Stay on his ass until you get answers or get fired. If you get fired, you can collect unemployment!

Responsibility without authority means it is time to go. If you are unhappy, unfulfilled and unable to affect change, it is time to go. If you are held accountable without a fair understanding of expectations, it is time to go. If you have no opportunity for professional growth, it is time to go. I can't think of one reason you should stay.

Hi Mindy! I always love your feedback, its honest and realistic! Sad thing is I have done most of this.

I dont necessarily need the budget to do anything, in fact its one thing less to worry about. However, dont tell me how I can get this bonus for meeting this and that, when I am not privy to even seeing it! How do I know he isnt pulling amounts out of his arse?

Contracts are not allowed to be at the site level. It hasnt stopped me from picking the brains of our contractors and such, because I NEED TO KNOW THE SCOPE OF THEIR WORK! So trust me, this I have done.

Vendors are becoming an issue by the day. They already know that everything has to go through corporate, at times they wont even talk to me about scheduling or anything..unless it has been approved.

Personnel issues, well I dont have the power to fire my asst, or write her up for that matter.

Marketing ideas, I was told "we have it covered on our end!" This was important to me because I have come apts that just came available by the pool. I want to post a CL ad that says talks about these particular apartments, cant do it!

Renae, What kind of person did this Owner/Corporate office want to hire? A robot? Someone to sit pretty in the office every day? When you mentioned a 15K bonus, I knew right away they were bluffing. No one offers that much of a Bonus and gives you no authority to implement an idea without knowing it is not achievable - so they wouldn't have to pay it. So, I guess you have two options: stay and look pretty and collect a paycheck while you look for another job or get the heck out of Dodge. I've worked with very challenging people but sometimes you just know when to cut your losses and when you have a chance in hell of making a difference.

Mindy, I am not sure what type of person he wanted, but I am definitely not the conforming type! I guess he thought because I'm young I am gullible. I got my start in the industry very early, so although I'm 30, I still have almost 10 years of verifiable experience. I am not impressed by numbers and bonuses - they mean nothing to me! But I've already made up my mind, I will be leaving next Friday so I can make sure my paycheck is good and then its back to the search!

I think this combination you inherited truly set you up to fail miserably. As someone who was in a similar situation, I can definitely relate.

I am sure you have already started distributing your resume (I would have); have you had any leads yet?

Hey Johnny! I have had a few leads, nothing major to be honest, but I can always find something. I left UTSA on 6/15 and started here on 8/3. I will just keep looking and hopefully I find my home, because all I want is to be at a property that is a reflection of me!

Is there a temp services agency in your market you can contact so you can have something until a more permanent opportunity opens up?

Not to keep this thread going on forever, but Mindy may have brought up the most important part of this problem. I often forget that we unknowingly hire some pretty scumbag managers for our properties. I guess I have no reason, or at least try not to think about it.
Yep, thinking back, the folks at the PMC have had some lulu's on the payroll. Sometimes I remember it taking a few months to find them out and get them out. In some cases, they stayed long enough to clean out the house. I would be at the main offices and I would see some new faces and I would wonder who----the

---

heck they were. At company meetings someone might get introduced as the new on-sites---- at

---

and I thought-what?
But, with tried and true in house employees, micromanagement should not be included anywhere.
Now I remember back to the good old Army where we would get those "shotgun blasts".
No matter who blew it, everyone got a hard message. I never liked that. Wanted to say deal with your problems, I'm not one of them. But it is the shotgun blast scenario with corporate types. They work under the "Everything's fine till something goes wrong" motto. Then high command blows sky high and everyone gets scalded over it. No, I don't like that. I quit putting up with it after the army.
I really liked Mindy's list of what ticks off corporate types. Pretty all inclusive too!!
This is a tired saying but you really do need to walk in the shoes of the other person. (Not saying any of this is the OP scenario problem). They might just be some kind of real (---) to work for/with.

Final point repeated from another thread. "The best way to have any job is not to have to have it at all". Get into that shape and the world tastes better.

Renae- It sounds like what they want is a rental manager. My 1st management position was many moons ago for an OMC (owner managed co.) who really just wanted a glorified leasing person to manage their sites. My first 5 years of property management (if you want to call it that) I never even saw a budget. I was to rent apartments, collect rent checks, and address resident issues. Even the maintenance dept. was a separate entity with managers that they reported to. I was never involved in raising rent, offering specials, or enhancements to the community. Those decisions all came from Corp. This put me at a real disadvantage at the next co. as it was a REIT. They live and die by numbers! Mindy's right, they want someone to sit in the office and look pretty. The OMC was the same. I couldn't hire any staff that the VP did not meet first to look over, and I mean look over. They said it was a second interview but really it was to make sure all staff had a certain look. Anyone who worked for this company had to be considered attractive, while it wasn't overtly sexual; at meeting you would look around and see a certain "type" of look. Their formula wasn't based on certain races or sexes, just everyone had to be "cute" or "pretty". I did have the ability to terminate leasing staff, so they get credit for that. There are still a few people I worked with then still working for them. It seems to me they are stuck there due to lack of real property management experience.

Wonder what would happen if you just walked in and fired your so-called
Assistant…What’s the worst that can happen? They fire you? Even if they do most likely they will not report that to an HR person seeking a reference. Like Mindy said you can just collect unemployment until you find the place that will truly appreciate your desire to make a difference rather than to warm a desk chair.

Is it just me or does every new manager walk into a situation where there are staffing issues, but no one bothered to address them until you came along? This has happened to me at almost every site. My new boss and I chat about the staff and they mention so-and-so really needs to go. It’s like okay if you knew that why haven’t you done it already?

I didn't have a budget or access to bills before the property I manage was purchased by an IRO. The Owner chose to live On Site during rennovations and was able to train me to manage a budget, negotiate with contractors, deal with hiring and firing and manage more effectivley to turn the property into an asset. Wht you are dealing with is a "slumlord". an Owner and or PMC who expects you to do their jobs with out giving you the tools. You're blindfolded at this time, and seeing how long you've been attempting to do this, you have two courses of action - One, to Leave and wash your hands of it or Two, take this Drive and Determination I see and put it to use. Age should not matter, it's Experience that really matters in this industry. If your Owner/PMC is not concerned with helping you do thier jobs, then it's time to move on. You Really need to have a plan laid out before you talk to them, and if they reject it, discuss other options. When you come to a loggerhead and cannot push through communication, it's time to go; move on.

OMG, I truly feel you, I am going through the same thing. I was transferred to a distress property because that is what I do and I love the challenge done it before. But this one is a nightmare I never worked under these circumstances, I almost think they put me there because they ran out of escape goats on who to blame for their poor managing and before I got there the CEO told me oh it has been remolded. after walking the units OMG! they cook the books the regional there he talks to other staff members with profanity and just awful! when he is on the properties everyone is shaking wondering if he had a bad day and taking out on them. Payables have not been paid within the last 2 years and when I ask for something they say you are not collecting and or leasing???? He cooks the books where the delinquent rent balances are to LOST UNCOLLECTIBLES. The city is on our case for things that did not get fixed 2010 and they say it is lack of trust with this company and now they want to blame me. Its amazing how the owner lets them get away with this. They want leases but cannot give me money for paint and my maintenance people give a 100% they make them work overtime and don't want to pay them for it. This is not human to work someone for 8 hours and make them stand on firewatch because no one pays much attention in 2010, he does not take accountability and neither will the CEO! I have had so much loyality and at this point and time DONT HAVE IT ANYMORE AND I DON'T HAVE THE RESPECT FOR THE CEO ANYMORE, I am and individual that looks at it as my property I would not trust this management company to manage it.

That sounds a lot like my last property when I stepped foot in the door......My most serious problems included:

-Vacancy (of 66 units, 17 were vacant)
-Delinquency (over $13000 in unpaid rents, as a result I had to 'welcome people to leave'; generating a spike in vacancies)
-Propertywide pest control issues (Bedbugs; small problem went unreported for so long it affected everyone).
-$100k+ in unpaid bills (I could not buy what we needed to turn the vacant units and had to pick the easiest ones to turn first)

6 months after I was hired, the owner fired the company that hired me; I stayed with the new company solving all the problems and put it back on track to be solvent. It was so bad, that I debated calling the owner myself to have an 'off the record' conversation about what I saw as the boots on the ground; but after seeking advice of those I trusted, I decided against it because I did not want to appear disloyal to the PMC and could not afford to risk my job for being the whistleblower. I had come to learn that the process to transfer management to the new company was in process before I stepped foot in the door. Come to think of it, I must have talked with the owner every 7-10 days between my initial hire and the time the property started to stabilize.

By the time I left; I had vacancy down to 3 units (with one working application), less than $1000 in delinquencies; the payables were under control (with financial assistance from the owner) and the pest control issue was resolved.


However, my understanding is that the OP of this thread is working directly for the owner that simply doesn't trust her, or cares enough about the financial health of his property to try.

So what happened with this, Renae??